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BG: Siege of Dragonspear release date, screenshots and more

Discussion in 'BG:EE - Siege of Dragonspear' started by Taluntain, Mar 4, 2016.

  1. Taluntain

    Taluntain Resident Alpha and Omega Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Now there's a shocker...
     
  2. Keneth Gems: 27/31
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    The team is really open about everything though, so you can see everything they're working on. It's not like they're not putting in a good effort. Still, it's a shame more people hadn't played the beta for v2.0. Could have avoided a lot of this if they had received the bug reports and feedback sooner. Well, that and if they had a bit more common sense between them. :shake:
     
  3. Marceror

    Marceror Chaos Shall Be Sown In Their Footsteps Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Careful Keneth, you are bordering on sounding understanding and appreciative. That could totally ruin your rep around here. :p
     
  4. Keneth Gems: 27/31
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    I'll forever be a cynic, but it's difficult to be mad at someone who you can see is working hard, even if they aren't especially competent. ;)
     
  5. Keneth Gems: 27/31
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    The reviews are starting to pour in and, well, I can't say I'm particularly surprised.

    Even all the technical issues aside, the devs should have known better than to try and push political ideology on players in a series like this.

    Not to mention the level of writing seems to be fairly poor and uninspired, so people are understandably upset when the bad vastly overshadows the good.

    It's gonna need a lot of patching and modding to get it into a somewhat decent state. Probably best to hold off on your purchases for now.
     
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  6. Darion

    Darion Resident Dissident Veteran BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Yeah, the whole LGTB angle and political correctness kinda surprised me.
    (They didn't mention any of this in their trailers, streams and whatnot.)
    Felt totally out of place in a game like BG, that played on all the right fantasy tropes / stereotypes.
    Worst of all it was totally a 'in yo face' approach. I don't play D&D for that kind of stuff. You need this in your game...well, Bioware's your friend.

    The usual crate-load of Bugs and funny design-choices in terms of UI were only mildly surprising. The Portrait selection (the custom ones) was the real shocker for me. As someone who has a extensive library i was quite miffed. That with being a click-fest.
    Other that that I don't mind the UI changes much. They are for the most part ok. And the Extra graphics options can be turned-off if desired. So no biggie that. The biggie was actually that once again, an update broke all mods. And turned yet another fundamental piece of archive around and made updating all the mods necessary...again. . Grrrrr.

    That said, the addd-on boast some really nice atmosphere and mood. The IE is pushing awesome effects in terms of areas and level of details. The Crowd in BG is another nice example.

    The Changes to the 'vanilla' portraits I do not mind. It's a fresh take on classics and I like the new Immy. And speaking of like....the Voice-Acting is a-w-e-s-o-m-e. Is like coming home...or old friends visiting.

    That being said, I think the Devs should have been more mindful writing SoD. The core audience is not the edgy sexually confused teen, but people like us in their prime. People who grew up with those characters and spent a great deal of time with them. Non of us felt that Jaheira's heckling of Khalid was such a big deal, or that Minsc was a mockery of all people mentally challenged.
    Maybe because we're from an age where none was easily offended or felt the need to seek attention my telling people constantly they liked pole or carpet or veggies.

    No matter, will play and enjoy this otherwise lovely addition to our D&D BG playground. An I'm looking forward where fans and modders will take this baby.

    Sorry for the rant. :D
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2016
  7. Keneth Gems: 27/31
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    I think a lot of the UI changes were largely designed for tablets again, which is highly annoying since IE games are first and foremost PC games and should be designed with that in mind.

    And yeah, all the social/political views were ham-fistedly shoehorned in at the behest of one of the lead writers, which is kind of insulting both to normal players and the people whom these bits were supposed to represent. Unless someone beats me to it, my first SoDs project will be getting rid of all this garbage that has no place in the game.
     
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  8. Marceror

    Marceror Chaos Shall Be Sown In Their Footsteps Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    I kind of liked that the "controversy" wasn't being discussed here, but I guess it was bound to be raised.

    Beamdog is removing the GG jab line that they gave Minsc, "ethics in gaming", or something like that.

    And apparently they will be rewriting the dialogue of the transgender character so that she doesn't explain her entire life story about being a woman stuck in a mans body if you so much as breathe near her.
     
  9. Taluntain

    Taluntain Resident Alpha and Omega Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Who wouldn't want a hefty dose of 2016 in their medieval-but-equal-rights fantasy setting, right? Right??? :shake:
     
  10. Keneth Gems: 27/31
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    We're equal opportunity murder hobos. No one ever cares which kobold is female before we slaughter them. Equal rights and equal lefts.

    But yeah, that's a good first step. Still, this should have come up during beta testing or QA. It's like they didn't have anyone with at least two brain cells playing the game before release.
     
  11. Taluntain

    Taluntain Resident Alpha and Omega Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    So unlike the other, thoroughly tested Beamdog releases. :heh:
     
  12. Keneth Gems: 27/31
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    Yeah, but we're talking incredibly basic things here. I know common sense is so rare that it's a superpower, but come on.

    Someone must have seen that and said something. Unless everyone was too afraid of being labeled small-minded and transphobic.

    Not that it would be too surprising, having seen the response from the developers to people who are understandably irate.
     
  13. Taluntain

    Taluntain Resident Alpha and Omega Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Some developers just feel that it's their responsibility to push the LGBT agenda in their games. *shrugs* I wonder if WotC knew about it because it'd be interesting if this was actually endorsed by them. I suppose that it's not unlikely that it was done to get favorable press with various larger gaming sites/networks who like to promote the same world view. These days especially it's far more important to cater to the fickle gaming press than the actual gamers. The backlash from the actual buyers just turned out to be greater than expected, I'm guessing.

    Edit: well, this is interesting. Everyone knows who Ed is, right? But that's just the point -- we all knew it was there, just nobody wanted their noses rubbed in it.

    The ShackNews article "Baldur's Gate expansion flooded with negative reviews due to presence of transgender character" sums it all up.

    More reading here too.
     
  14. Keneth Gems: 27/31
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    The last article sums it up quite nicely. It's not the inclusion of these elements that's the problem—Dorn was already bisexual and nobody batted an eye because it wasn't shoved down people's throats—it's about their presentation and twisting of the established lore and characters. No one cares that there's a transgender character in the game when you can get a Girdle of Masculinity/Femininity in the first 30 min of the game and change your sex at will. In fact, that's what I did in one of my first playthroughs and I rolled with it even after I found a way to remove the curse. Frankly, they deserve all the hate they're getting because no one there had the sensibility to know better and instead of owning up to it, they decided the best course of action would be to further insult their player base. That said, I do feel bad for all the devs who had nothing to do with these shenanigans and just wanted to make cool stuff and a better game.
     
  15. Blades of Vanatar

    Blades of Vanatar Vanatar will rise again Adored Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Well... Being a superior race what else would you expect from us Borg... I mean Americans...

    --

    Hey.... There is supposed to b a smiley with tongue sticking out at the end of my last post but I can't see it....

    --

    I have no played SoD yet but I have read a bunch of articles on 'the' subject. I think they must of hired Trump as executive content approved...
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 23, 2016
  16. Beren

    Beren Lovesick and Lonely Wanderer Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    The PC agenda was being forced into the BG games well before this. Cernd anyone? I'm half-native myself, and frankly ... I just could never get into Cernd as a character. The whole cardboard (to the point of comical) stereotype of how all Natives remain stoic thoughtful gentle guardians of nature with awesome shapeshifting powers ... it's just uncomfortable for me on so many levels. Not just Cernd. T. Hawk in SF. Nightwolf in MK. etc.

    How about older generation Natives like myself who were long-haired teenagers who got by on AC/DC and floor hockey and Stanley Cup playoffs and arcade games, and too messed up with their personal problems to give a crap about saving Mother Earth? How about the current generation who are messed up and have really poor guidance with a lack of stable family structure and with hip-hop gangsta culture as a very poor substitute. How about the plenty of Natives out there who are disconnected from traditional culture and are trying to get $ in the white man's professional world to the point of self-shame? The problem with laughable cardboard stereotypes is that they end up being so milky positive to the point of being offensive in a different kind of way, by completely ignoring the extensive real world complexities of the subject matter.

    Now, if there was a culture / society in Faerun that could have provided a meaningful backstory for Cernd, maybe I could have bought in. But I just didn't see it. It was forced.

    As for this most recent turn, I'm as tolerant as anyone else, but if anything can turn a person off from PC gone too far, it's the stifling atmosphere that PC can create in academia and university campuses. Campuses where everyone, students and faculty alike, often feel like they're having to walk on egg shells to avoid very severe consequences for actions that for a lot of people would amount to relatively normal human behavior and expression.

    I sure don't like having extreme PC rammed down my throat in the workplace, but I navigate it as best I can as a necessary evil of sorts. I surely don't want it rammed down my throat when I get home and want to kick back and relax with a little RPG gaming. Sorry, I don't think I'll be touching this one ...
     
  17. Keneth Gems: 27/31
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    I've never really seen Cernd as some sort of "PC agenda". A stereotype, sure, but it's not like he's the only trope in the game. I mean, Baldur's Gate and Faerun are pretty much as generic as it gets. Even characters that depart from the usual stereotypes do so in a very obvious manner.

    Then again, maybe I just don't see it. It's entirely possible that it was some SJW's attempt to alleviate his "white guilt" for the holocaust of American natives. Not really sure what the people's state of mind was all those years ago. Maybe token native characters were then what token trans characters are now.
     
  18. Darion

    Darion Resident Dissident Veteran BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Interesting thing about Cernd, I never saw him in that light. But it seems some people did interpret it that way.
     
  19. Blades of Vanatar

    Blades of Vanatar Vanatar will rise again Adored Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Aren't fantasy RPGs games stereo typical by nature? Many show or force you to choose between various races/classes. As a player you make a choice as to what you think is the best race/class or choose to play what you want to experience. I highly doubt the devs have an agenda. I think some fans are giving them way too much credit...
     
  20. Beren

    Beren Lovesick and Lonely Wanderer Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    On the heels of Bruce / Caitlyn Jenner being hailed as a hero for bravely facing life transgendered? I don't think so.
     

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