What do you think, which is better, BG1+TotSC or BG2+ToB? Why?

I think BG1 is much better. It is simple (fewer spells and creatures, etc), but much better.
Not so monumental.
I think the spell system is boring and a bit annoying in BGII+ToB.

For example: in BG2 there are many spells, but let me see: Pierce Shield, Pierce Magic, Secret Word, etc. - the same effect (ok, there is a little difference, f.e. Pierce Shield lowers MR): cancel a spell protection.

Or Disintegrate: good spell, but I think that almost nobody used it on individual enemies (like Firkraag, the Shadow Drgaon, or even Baron Ployer), because it may destroy items.

Flesh to Stone : almost the same, and if you want to get the items, you have to use Stone to Flesh

Imprisonment: the same

There are many many other problems I think.
But anyway, BGII is very very good, too.

On a 20unit scail, I give BG1 number 19, and BGII gets 17.

How about you? And why?

[ August 26, 2002, 19:13: Message edited by: Baronius the Sorcerer ]

I personnally prefer BG2 and ToB as together I think they are great! if you have an annoying spell then just don't use it :rolleyes: you can delete it from a spellbook anyway. In BG1 I found the graphics were to be desired and animation was awkward. BG2 improved and I found it more enjoyable - especially as you can customize it ;)

Because of the amount of classes and kits I think BGII is better. I have never re-played a game as many times as I have played BGII. BGI becomes annoying sooner because a full party contains almost all kits. BGII get's a 19 from me. It's the way a game should be.
There are only 2 reasons it doesn't get a 20 from me.
1) When I bought it long time ago it came heavily packed with bugs and the patch was not yet out.
2) When you die the game doesn't show the message window anymore, so you don't know what kills you. Do you have any idea how long it took me to figure out it was imprisonment elder orbs cast?

BG get's a 16 from me.

[ August 26, 2002, 07:36: Message edited by: StressedE ]

IF BG1 gets all the stuff in BG2, kits, seperate Journals, extra speed etc, then I WILL perfer BG1 over 2.

Well yeah, but if BGII get's all the area's in BGI I will prefer BGII over BGI :D :D :D

I think the story in BG is better than in BG2. It might be that I was sleeping some times, but I've finished BG2 2 times now and I still haven't figured out WHY Irenicus wanted me... He stole my soul to become immortal or something, but why me? I mean, apparently everyone thinks (In the Game) that the 5 are stronger than me, so why doesn't he use them?!

BG1 was just SO cool.... but I guess if I'd play it again, I'd miss all the good spells and the good weapons and would die a lot of times, because of moves that are suicidal in BG but not in BG2 (As I have 200HP in BG2 and had only 80 in BG for example....)

So I guess they would gain the same amount... Both a 19... BG2 ToB is just SO many hack&slash, but I never seem to get bored of it...

BTW, I never played TotSC, as it was full of bugs and couldn't find good patches anywhere...

I think BG+Totsc is way better, :)
Mostly becuse ToB sucks :nolike:

BG is better (in my humble opinion), because it has better story, more freedom, and NPCs such as commoners, etc do not all say exactly the same thing, along with a multitude of other differences.

You are right.
I just didnt want to write down these things, but these are the real differences, indeed.
And many many other things...
But I didnt say BGII is not good, I just said that BG1 is much better.

I will get Dark Side of the SW, I heard that it is good.

I wote for BG2+ ToB. I just like those monumental fights with tough legendary monsters unlike BG1 which doesnt even contain a single dragon :rolleyes: wyverns just dont meke the same effect.
If i can choose from all Bg games and extras seperately then i prefer ToB over any other :D :D . ToB offers most various weaponry, spellcraft and all such things. Its just shame mages get a little weaker due to monsters saving throws :eek:

I did play BGI, but never got the ToTSC. But in comparison between them, I like the kits, NPC interaction, romances, and from BGI I liked the fact that you walked through areas, not just travelled to an area (like from City Gates to Trademeet). When I am reunited with all of my possessions, I will probably get ToTSC and replay Baldur's Gate from the beginning.

One thing that wasn't right with BGII is that Minsc and Jaheira were so weak in that game. Most times they were weaker than me, while in BGI, I was the weak one. That is in the beginning of the game.

BG1: Goods:

-A LOT of Houses that ain't related to quest
-Hundreds of quests
-Lots of ways to solve quests
-Logical Quests
-Need to use STRATEGY (eg, you might fight Nimbul 2375028375082375 times and still not beat him in BG1 but beat him with a single hit in BG2)
-BRILLIANT NPC interactions

BG1: Bads:

-Crap AI and Graphics, plus it haven't got some nifty additions.
-No deepened NPC
-Everything happens too fast ("Hi." "Hi." "Want me to join?" "Sure!")
-Not enough choices

BG2: Goods:

-Kits
-Good graphics

BG2: Bads:

-Powergaming (oh look, another +2 plate! Not another one...)
-Crap storyline (hides)

ToB: Goods:

-Supreior Graphics

ToB: Bads:

-MAJOR Powergaming (ahh, another +4 weapon...*yawn*)

As much as i understand powergaming is not encountering +6 and more items through the game.

Its goin about character developing.I mean if you create kensai level 25 and then dual him to thief to get as powerful as you can(25/27).and yes of course all stats 25 too. ;)

[ August 27, 2002, 07:53: Message edited by: Gothmog4230 ]

Powergaming is creating the most powerful character possible.
In other words a combination of stats, class and inventory.

All 25 stats isn't powergaming anymore it's cheating. (unless you use wish)

The enemies you encounter need +4 weapons to hit, so it is only natural you find a lot of them.
Would you prefer being restricted to choosing one particular weapon because it's the only one that can hit enemies?

IMHO - BGII is much better than the first part.

You have a lot of possibilities - kits / spells / weapons proficiencies / tactics ... Of course it is limited compared to PnP, but BI tried to make it as deep as possible. The NPC reactions, storyline / quests (stronghold) depending on the protagonist class - this was one of the nicest gaming experiences I had :) .

Too many spells ? Well - would you prefer to have "Some Bolt", "Some Cloud" and "Some Boost" ? Even that you use only a favored (effective) part of them, the possibility of the other ones still helps to create the game depth.

As for above mentioned "powergaming" - would you like to go on a dragon with a Long Sword +1 ? ;) From my point of view are the items in the game quite balanced ... even that there are (legal) tricks as to get very good equipment soon after start.

I have played PT, IWD + HoW, BGI+ToSC, BGII+ToB, and the last is still my most favorite :D

I have to agree with Deathmage about the powergaming aspect... You find all those +4 and +5 weapons, and they're no fun anymore, because you already have those....or stronger. And why don't you find those in BG? Because there are weaker monsters? Do you really believe there are no strong monsters in the sword coast? Sure, they would be to strong, but why don't they throw in some weaker creatures in ToB then? The weakest I've seen is an umberhulk or some of that ****. Why don't I see Kobolds? They're not ONLY living near the city of Baldur's Gate....

And have you notices that always when you find a piece of an item, the other piece is always near...? I'd like it if they would throw in a piece in BG and then the other in ToB for instance, or just a piece in ToB and then no other piece... Sure you can't use it then, but it's only reality that you don't always find the whole items in real-life....

Lord Ogre

Possibly your fame is so great that by the time of ToB all the Kobols etc. run away at the merest sign of your approach :)

One item has been introduced which is completed across different games - the Pantaloons. OK it's an Easter egg, but still... if more items were introduced which had no purpose (because another required item wasn't provided) the boards would be full of people saying "What does this Axe-Shaft (or whatever) do???" Unless that's the reason for the empty bottles in SoA...

BG2.

I'd have to say BG2+ ToB. I like the more intricate stories (with romances...and then the NPC's actually have their own lives!) and details are extrodinary.

I agree with the others about +4 weapons in ToB. After all the neat stuff in the previous BG's, these new toys fall short and become boring. Same thing with the spells...some I forget I even have and they don't get put to much use. There's too many of them to keep track of!

ToB storyline sucked. I hated it. BG2's wasn't bad, but it didn't quite add up to the shocking effect of being a Bhaalspawn in the first game. Cheers for BG1 plot! It wasn't a bad game...just poorly detailed and more simple (No dragons either! They are just awesome creatures that shouldn't be left out of any fantasy game).

Bg2. Baldurs gate had the best plot by far, but I think SoA since you get monk, half orc, kits, ect. ToB wasn't very good because the plot had to do with nothing but the bhaalspawn. There was very few subquests compared to 1 and 2, and not must else you could do other than continue with the main quest.

[ August 28, 2002, 01:48: Message edited by: Lithorn ]

BGII+ToB offers many many new things, characters, interaction, hundreds of spells...

But I am just unable to find the "feeling" of BG1...
The big areas, nice forests, dark caves...
I like very very much BGII, but after playing them for many years, I must admit: BG1 is better...

It is also very interesting that in ToB you can buy +3 weapons in Saradush in the inn...
(it could be a shop, or a store, it is the same)
In BG1 you have to visit Durlag's Tower to get 4-5 +3 weapons...
Yes, I know that in BGII+ToB characters are very powerful, and enemies too, so good weapons are a necessity, but the Sword Coast and its areas (Amn, BG, Tethyr, stc) would not be so different in the case of weapons and enemies...
In BGII, you can find a 15th level mage in almost every street, while in BG1 I think only Semaj was so powerful (OK, Shandalar was lev 30, but he was the only)

I know that Mind Flayers are AD&D creatures, but I dont like them...
Not only because they are very potent enemies, rather because they seem to be a little science fiction... I do not know... They are odd... They do not belong to this world about my opinion...

I will get Dark Side, and Icewind Dale, because I heard that they are good.
But I will play NWN certainly (as soon as it becomes purchasable here)

I think I will never find a game like BG1...
Its "feeling"... It is like tale...
But enough. Simply I think that Baldurs Gate is the best game I have ever played.

[ August 28, 2002, 20:08: Message edited by: Baronius the Sorcerer ]

BG2+ToB. Yes, I agree with everyone else about the overpowered items, and that's one of the reasons I've been modding them, but I just got into it's storyline a lot more than BG1. Maybe it's due to the fact that I don't like mysteries as much, or because I was foolish enough to read the entire story before I played the game.

but you gotta agree that it would be fun to start that level 1 wizard-slayer and give him 2 * in single weapon style and in long sword... or as a level 1 monk... or as a level 1 mage... wait... that one already exist... i wanted to do this in IWD2 but they removed the kits so now i wont buy the game... i want kits...

I prefer BG2+ToB because of the mere fact that I wasn't able to play TotSC. :grin:

BG2-ToB Roleplaying

'Cos it's the best man, :cool: :hippy:

I seem to remember there being a mod somewhere that let you start BG2 at level 1.

I do not want any such mods for BG2.
I like it as good as it is!

I mentioned a lot that I just think that BG1 is better! The BG2 does not offer the "feeling" that BG1 gives to you I think...

[ September 03, 2002, 11:24: Message edited by: Baronius the Sorcerer ]

Although i prefer ToB :D i agree that BG1 has quite a diffrent feeling than BG2+ToB as Baronius said.