Since this is my first shot at Tactics, I figured I'd post my thoughts and/or ways I beat the harder battles to see if anyone can give me any insight and/or opinions. I'm currently in chapter 4.

"Improved" Illych: Beat him by using some ultimately cheesy methods, as in running from the Fallen Deva and waiting for it to go away. Basically just funneled them to me using to hall and picked em off one at a time. To tell the truth, I liked him better before.

Improved Torgal: Loved this one. Most fun I've had with my armour on. Slightly confused about how the doors couldn't stay closed. Slighty pissed about how 6 Spirit Trolls cast Greater Command at you, and there's no way to buff against that.

Improved Shadow Dragon: Holy crap I cannot believe its' breath weapon. It drained Jahiera of 9 lvls. Aside from that I didn't really see much change, except that it was pathetically vulnerable to fear.

Improved Bodhi: Fighting her with a lvl 10 party in Ch. 3 is frustrating, not to mention a good way to give yourself a brain spasm. The only way I managed to beat her was by having my PC run around her like a moron while Jaheira beat up on her with Torgal's Claw. I kept doing that forever, then she pops up and says her "that's was educational..." bit. I think I may have drained her STR with Torgal's Claw. She's also Immune to Prot. from Undead? What the deal-eo?

Improved Beholders: Why do the Gauths do poison damage now? Do they need to brush their teeth real bad?

Improved Vamps: Slightly tougher, I guess. Didn't really notice much. I can still walk around with just one tank with Negetive Plane Prot. and kill the whole guild.

Improved Mages: Much needed. Now a thief can't just walk up and one-hit a mage (which, of course, I NEVER did ;) )


Anyway, that's how far I am now. I'll update later, assuming I get some responses.

Some spoliers - stay away, Harbourboy!

Improved Bodhi is a nightmare - I ended up having to stash my party back at the entrance to the tomb, have the PC stake the last vampire, then run like he was on fire until Bodhi just gave up on him. I honestly think Imp. Bodhi would have been much better if she got her über-powers for Chapter 6, for fairly obvious reasons. Of course, with Undead Solaufein, there's really only one option that works, and that's run like hell and wait his defences out.

But if you think that was bad, wait until you run into Kangaxx or Firkraag... don't say I didn't warn you, MC.

Improved Torgal: Loved this one. Most fun I've had with my armour on. Slightly confused about how the doors couldn't stay closed. Slighty pissed about how 6 Spirit Trolls cast Greater Command at you, and there's no way to buff against that.Shouldn't Chaotic Commands work?

Improved Beholders: Why do the Gauths do poison damage now? Do they need to brush their teeth real bad?Apparently so, because beholders are well-known for their vicious melee abilities...

Improved Vamps: Slightly tougher, I guess. Didn't really notice much. I can still walk around with just one tank with Negetive Plane Prot. and kill the whole guild.In Chapter Six, they are annoying. For some reason, they always charm Wulfgar, and then all of Drizzt's group leaves when Wulfgar starts wailing on my party with Aegis Fang.

Nice topic :thumb:

I'd like to share my bits too:

Improved Torgal: I had my party wait in the Umberhulk room, all buffed up and set 7 traps, then had my thief sneak into the throne room to lure Torgal out. The traps did their parts and Torgal was badly wounded, a few more hits and he was dead. Cheesy, yes, but who care? ;)

Improved Bodhi: I think she will run away after a while, so if you can't beat her, run :)

Improved Beholders: as usual, shield of balduran, there isn't much tactics involved here.

Improved Mages: use elemental arrows (eg: acid) on them, they won't be able to cast spell, then just hack them to piece, work in most case.

The great thing about Illych is that his Achilles Heel is (to me) perfectly believable. They send patrolers out (the suboptimal tactics that they joke about in the dialogue), and if you are really fast, you can kill one before the rest arrive. Kill him, then scatter into the rest of the dungeon and hide. The place is impossible to lock down because of all the hallways--it's like a rat's nest. The trick is getting one of the patrolers alone, since they frequently travel in pairs or triplets.

Improved TorGal gives me a ton of trouble. I find it essential to stop him in a doorway against a super-reliable tank, either in the doorway to his chamber or by leading him farther away from his spirit troll shock troops. Pelt him with everything you have.

(One of the easy ways to beat him is if you use Valen mod, as I am for my current game)

One thing I did notice is that the Fledgling Vampires Domination ability seems to have been souped up and it is horrifically less likely you'll save vs. spells. I had Anomen with NPP and it took him 10 minutes to kill this one vamp. She kept charming him. I was pissed. I just sat there waiting for the spell to wear off. I finally got tired of waiting, so I had everyone else run in there and finish her off (after a little dispel action).

Anyway, I'm in Brynlaw right now and I just finished offing Perth the Adept. Too easy considering he's got a string of buffs that reads about 6 inches long. Then again, I AM playing an Inquisitor, so that might have something to do with it. I figured I might as well play one of the most powerful classes if I was taking on Tactics.

Chaotic Commands, or even better a helm of charm protection, is very helpful in dealing with improved vampires. Their charming ability is very frustrating.

Hope you've got +3 weapons for going through Spellhold.

Just witnessed the Improved Demons part. To tell the truth I think that it's the worst part I've seen. A Pit Fiend can now: A) Cast Improved Invisibilty at will, will a casting time of 0, unlimited times, which he does if you're protected from evil. B) Cast Gate, which summons another Pit Fiend. That wouldn't be so horrible if the second demon couldn't also gate in another Pit Fiend. C) Can cause poison damage of 999 points.

To tell the truth, this last ability really really pissed me off. Why the hell did they pick 999 points of poison damage? Wouldn't it be wayyy cooler if it was 666 points? :D

I removed the improved demons as soon as I figured out that I could. They made every lich into a fight well able to annihilate your entire party. If you arent very high level and have great ecquipment you wont finish off the first pit fiend before it gates in another. When I was in Spellhold which I had rushed to cause I wanted Solaufein as soon as possible I ended up trying to fight four or more pit fiends every time and it was impossible. I was forced to uninstall that part. Demons, Bodhi and Firegiants are the tactic sections I have removed, those fights are just not fun just frustrating.

I have played through SoA twice now with tactics and still havent got a random encounter inside Athakatla. That is actually my biggest beef with tactics seeing as Aldeth's review said that it was one of the best parts of tactics.

[ Geez, I thought I wrote that review. :rolleyes: ;) ] - Beren

[ November 02, 2004, 07:27: Message edited by: Beren ]

The parts I didn't install/uninstalled later were:

Improved Ilych
Always Hardest Spawns
Improved Druid Grove
Improved Marching Mountains/Tougher Fire Giants
Red Badge Encounter
Improved Small Teeth Pass

All because I heard they were crappy or because I didn't like it when I did try it. Oh, and I definetly DON'T want tougher Fire Giants. Those guys chew me up already.

I found Improved Torgal to be too easy. Mind you, if I had rushed into the room I probably would have found him WAY too hard. Fortunately, being the knowledge oriented person that I am, the first time I came to enter Torgal's domain, I sent my thief forward, hidden in shadows, and discovered that torgal could see him, but no others. Fleeing, Torgal follows, and my entire party beat on him. He was still rather tough, but no match for an entire party, especially when he, like many other monsters with tactics, "lock on" to one party memeber and hound them. Can't they understand that they'll never hit that character since (s)he's running a circle around the other party members? gah!

I sided with Bodhi, so I haven't experienced any of these tough battles so frequently spoken of.

To unistall features, I just run the setup-tactics.exe again right? And it'll lead me through it?

Yes, that's right Geoff. Just re-run the setup program and install/reinstall/uninstall as desired.

You mention one of the things that really bugs me about Tactics, though - almost without exception, they go after the PC to the exclusion of anything else. I had a PC Monk standing back in the doorway of Firkraag's lair, and Korgan and Haer'Dalis stepped up to face him first (with a few summons to back them up). What does Mr. F do? Dragon Breath: PC. He can't even SEE the guy, and yet for some bizarre reason, he nukes him first despite there being several keen-to-kill fighters around him. In the end I just thought "sod this" and PW: Reloaded until Quivering Palm worked.

Improved Mae'var is painful but not impossible with True Sight, Invisibility 10ft and a bit of patience... and Iron/Stone Skins out the wazoo.

Improved Druid Grove is good, until you reach the end.

The problem with uninstalling tactics is if you've an entered an area already modified by it, it will act weird... For example, when I had to uninstall Maevar (damn bastard is REALLY hard with a level 8 party), afterwards all the Improved enemies were there, but without their AI. They just stood there while I beat on Maevar (who didn't attack either). Kinda dissappointing.

Maevar made me give up on tactics, but with Valen in my party now I'm thinking of giving it another try... it seems almost cheap to NOT use tactics with her in your party...

@ joacqin - really stupid question, but are you sure you have that particular component installed? Maybe when you installed Tactics, you skipped that component by mistake.

Back to the demons, many areas in the game have a lich, and so the odds of facing a pit fiend at a low level are very high (until you know to avoid those spots...). Two things:

First, all those powers are just to make the pit fiends match their pnp incarnation. At least they don't summon 1d4 more pit fiends every round!

Second, and more applicable, is that this component resurrects an otherwise dead spell--protection from evil. You have to go right by a lich in Spellhold, so if you rush there, you *must* have protection from evil 10' radius, or enough protection from evil spells to get everyone past him. I ran into the same problem going through Umar Hills, where there are two liches that you can't avoid. This component also makes you treasure those +3 weapons--finding enough to take on pit fiends becomes a priority. That's the only reason I do D'Arnise Stronghold now--for the flail and the axe.

As for improved Mae'Var, that's just a matter of disabling all those evil little buggers and picking them apart with missile fire and spells. I usually toss a web, a stinking cloud, a chaos, and a slow, and that does the trick. Usually.

I never encounter Pit Fiends that often, Liches never summon them for me. They do have a billion timestops though....

Ericr Xanthus - I never saw no Lich in Spellhold. Wha the deal?

Anyhoo, Just finished off Improved Sahuagin City of Caverns, and I gotta say there's a few things about this that made me go "Uhhhh". Not to mention "F***!". First off, I had Anomen with the Shield Of Reflection, and then as soon as they shoot him and realize it doesn't work, then they abandon any whim of shooting him and go straight for some other character. Good and deadly AI there.

BUT, what is the deal with having 150 paralytic bolts that weigh 1 pound each?! Not to mention 12,000 scrolls of Oracle, which they never use. Anyway, the Minor Avatar of Sekolah leaves me feeling not-so-guilty for using the Cloak of Mirroring.

And I now like the Improved Demons because I figured out that I can summon my own superpowered freaks! MUHAHAHahahahaha. And Eric Xanthus? If you have Prot. from Evil on then the Pit Fiends just continually cast ImpInv on themselves, so you can't kill em'.

BTW, Earth Elementals are immune to the bolts those bastards fire. They just don't last too long when they start in with the spears. Just so ya know.

@Mystra: The Spellhold lich only appears if you go there with a high-level party. If your rush to chapter 4, you'll never see it. It's on the same level that has the umber hulk "trap" (where you get trapped in a room with umber hulks attacking from both sides, at the entrace to the level), to the south and slightly west of the trap in question.

As for the lich in Spellhold, I thought Tactics had changed it so that one always appeared there. I went through pretty fast and still ran into him just outside the library and the cursed vampire. Ah well.

And yeah, I know all about that stupid programming problem with Pit Fiend invisibility and protection from evil. The real problem is not that they can become invisible at will--that's just the way they are in pnp. The real problem is the way the game executes True Sight. True Sight *should* simply ignore invisibility spells--you *see* right through them. But instead, it dispels illusions, and the pit fiends just turn invisible again. So you either let them become invisible and go right by them (which is what you do when you don't have +3 weapons), or you keep one of your warriors (best defense, periapt of proof against poison, etc.) unprotected. The Pit Fiend goes for him, and all your protected guys beat him down. The other way to really take advantage of this is to use summons, or even just attack him before he kills off all the undead surrounding him. The Pit Fiend will become visible to attack them, and your protected warriors will beat him down.

Well, I'm outta the Underdark and into the big bad battles of Tactics.

Improved Guarded Compound: I didn't do this until now because I didn't need to... I've got no one using Katanas. Anyway, it's not too hard if you A) kill what's-his-name-the-mage-guy, and B) Cast Death Spell to rid the room of the fodder they summon. I personally liked this fight better when I tackled it with TDD installed. That one added a Frost Giant.

Improved Firkaag: I was an average of lvl 15 or so when I killed him, which is pretty high, but I found him to be a total pansy. Granted, 2 of my party were near death, but whatever. Also, the battle was real short.

Twisted Rune slaughter: Either I'm going to have to get real strong, or real smart in order to beat these mofo's. I think I'll try again later. They're hard as rock.

Time to tackle Kangaxx...

Improved Kangaxx: This was lame. I mean, it practically forces you to use both Scrolls of Prot. from Magic because you need 2 people whammin' on him just to beat his lvl drain. Other than that the fight last about 30 seconds. The fight upstairs was semi-hard, except for those friggin dwarves. They were beastly.

Yes, I have made sure that I have that component installed Splunge.

Kangaxx is still scripted to die instantly to teh Mace of Disruption+2, demi-Kangaxx dies instantly at the first strike from that mace every single time I play.

Improved Guarded Compound is easy after the Underdark - killing Sion is the only tough part; throw out a Death Spell and the Skeleton Warriors drop, use Insect Plague and the spellcasters don't cause you any trouble either.

Improved Twisted Rune are hardcases, though - especially Shangalar. My suggestion is: buff up in the alcove, trigger the Skull Traps with one character using the Cloak of Mirroring, and make absolutely certain that you have anti-invisibility spells, Death magics and area-affect offensive spells available by the bucketload, and summoning a few Mordy swords will keep them occupied. Malison + Chaos works well on the Rune Assassins, too. Haste everyone and run like hell across the room (except the guy with the Cloak of Mirroring) so Shangalar's hideous chain contingency won't slaughter everyone in the party. Globe of Invulnerability and Spell Immunity: Abjuration will help immensely, too, as it will mean you can keep your buffs when Shangalar and Layene cast Remove Magic. They are bastards to beat without a lot of micromanagement.

Yeah I have a very specific strategy too. You don't have to use cloak of mirroring to safely trigger those skulltraps, first of all. A good old mirror image does the same thing. Moving your team post haste to the east end of the room is important, but I find you need to determine some matchups very carefully. I don't even worry about Shangalar and Layene until I've dealt with the beholder and the vampire at the least.

As for the rest, I figure we should let you beat them before we spill all our bag of tricks. :)

Well I've toasted the Twisted Rune and Improved Chapter 6 Bodhi. Both were relatively easy once I figured out a decent strategy. For both the Twisted Rune and Bodhi, I reloaded after I beat them so I could do it again. Lots of fun.

Bodhi was too easy though. Drizzt and Eric Van whateverstraaten handled the other vamps while I beat on Bodhi. Couple Lower MR and then high level offensive spells (chain lightning, horrid wilting) seemed to take care of her. I'm glad she wasn't horribly overpowered though. I don't really like battles like that (*cough* Eclipse crew *cough*).

For the Twisted Rune baddies I just had my Pally with the Cloak of Mirroring and Carsomyr (not to mention a couple other trinkets to bring my MR up to 70%) take care of Shangalar and Layene, then the rest of the party showed their worth by wasting everyone else. Beholder was first for sure. Anomen made sure of that. At the same time Minsc with Imp. Mace o' Distruption took care of that bad-ass-4-drain-per-hit Vampire. Lady Jah had no trouble with Ravenek. Meanwhile Kelsey was whippin' out the horrid wiltings and death spells on Cameron (my pally) so that the Mordenakain's Swords would pose no threat. Kelsey ended up killing both Shangy on Layene with a horrid wilting. The Rune Assassins seemed to be immune to Horrid Wilting spells, so Jan wasted no time in turning out the Fireballs and Flame Arrows and Lighting Bolts. What was left of them my paladin finished off.

What really pissed me off though was that Shangalar and Layene were pulling Time Stops outta their asses every round. But what really got me was they were totally wasting them with crappy spells. Oh well. Really fun fight though.

Improved Irenicus: Hot damn. This is near impossible. I seriously can't even get passed the damn dragon. I'll have to keep trying. *grumble* Stupid sword of greed goin' after my casters with it's *grumble* lvl drain.

Well you're making good time MC. You have to go nuclear on Irenicus, but it sounds like you only have 1.5 wizards (Kelsey and Jan). Between them, they should *just* be able to take out the dragon and the sword. I'll be interested to see how Sarevok goes; he's always the hardest for me.

Ok. Seriously. This is pissing me off something fierce. I cannot beat this mutherFUdge-loving battle.

So far I've gotten past the Dragon of Pride, and the Orb of Fear. I don't know how I'm supposed to beat the Sword of Greed. What am I supposed to do? Throw Magic Missles at it all day? I don't have time for that! Flame Arrow does nothing. I wonder about Bolt of Glory? A couple of those and it's bound to be hurtin' a little! Huh?!

Wraith of Wrath is a totally different story. I wish I could just get him tangled up in a couple Mordy's Swords so that I could get a moment to think! He takes the least amount of strategy to beat. If I could get him to attack Jaheira with her Ironskins, then I think I could take him down pretty easy.

Irenicus or Selfishness or whatever is something I'm confused about. He seems to do the least of all 4. But so far I think I've got my hitlist:
1) Dragon of Pride
2) Orb of Fear
3) Sword of Greed (first I disable it with Feeblemind. Seems to work alright for awhile. Confusion and spook don't.)
4) Wraith of Wrathvok

Then I'm done :)

EDIT: Just found out the Sword of Greed is very very easy. Death Spell works just fine. :D

[ November 04, 2004, 06:25: Message edited by: Mystra's Chosen ]

I would have suggested Horrid Wilting, but if it's coded as a summons or a Mordy Sword, then Death should work just fine.

Well. I did it. I beat Tactics on core my first try. And in good time I might add.

I found the Final Battle SOOOOO drawn out. I mean, c'mon. You have to "kill" Irenicus THR33 TIMES!! And what's with him teleporting around to every entrance, then whenever you catch up with him, he teleports away again. I find that more than annoying.

Anyway, despite it's little flaws, Tactics is a sweet mod. It's a keeper :) I especially like Improved D'Arnise Keep and the Improved Twisted Rune.

The final battle is a bother the first time but it is much easier the second time. I had no big problem in my last run. I wonder though if it is possible to beat Irenicus as slayer as a non-tank without the acid katana? Both the times I ahve fought him I have just run around with the acid katana and got struck now and then which have hurt Irenicus. My exhausted Wild Mage/Thief saw no other way, I did accidentely gender change Irenicus as slayer but it just turned him into a vampire, which was kinda good cause they dont run as fast.

I had my Fighter/Mage memorize multiple instances of Protection from Magic Weapons. He'll keep himself protected, rush over to his equipment, and then keep himself protected as he dices Irenicus the Slayer.

The only other way I can think of is to turn into the Slayer yourself and paste him. Drawback to that is it leaves you tired for the final leg. Hence, my adoption of the method described above.

*damn* I wish I had the time to update my guides.

I never had any problem running up and get my gear, with no protection at all. Even with the gear it is hard to beat Irenicus the slayer with no real melee capability, thought it was cheesy to just let the acid katana kill him so I tried minute meteor him but that was pointless as I hit with one out of three and I could only throw one or two before I had to run away again.

Could be that you are supposed to go slayer on his ass but a good character do not like that.

I usually use a sequencer or trigger of magic missile on Greed, but as you've all said, a couple of things will do the trick. As for Slayerenicus, my first time through the mod I didn't rest my sorcerer before the final battle. When I unloaded everything I had left on Slayerenicus, it only took him to badly injured and I just couldn't hit him enough with my staff. With no tricks left...Slayer time! That was a pretty big thrill. Then, of course, there was the Amazing Teleportirenicus, which drove me nuts.

Anyway, good job on taking him out. It is a bit of an endurance test.

I didn't have too much trouble with the round where he strips all your gear off. I cast Prot. from Evil on myself, then guzzled a poition of speed, then ran up and got Carsomyr. He only does about 5 damage per hit or so, but it takes awhile.

Where I had my trouble is with that bloody dragon, although after I figured out the only spell needed to beat him was a Breach, then it got easier.

What I did at the beginning of the battle was I put 4 Mordy's Swords down where all the baddies come up, that way, it buys me a little more time, and I get a whack at the Dragon first. Since the Dragon just wing buffets the swords, he comes flying up to get 'em again. The other Mordy's Swords tangle up Greed and Wrath, which is nice so you don't have to worry about them. Wraith of Wrath is really the hardest I guess, since it doesn't matter how manny protections you've got on, his STR drain with get you in the end. And his AC is so low. By the time I finished the battle, only characters left were Minsc, my PC and Kelsey. He killed the rest!

Wraith of Wrath gives me a hell of a time, since I usually play magic heavy groups. Three or four magic users run like little girls from him. I found success with superbuffing, but I thought a more warrior-oriented party like yours would have an easier time than that.

The problem with Wrath is that he drain yer flippin' strength, which, as everyone know, if any stat gets to 0, you die (which, as I think of it, why do you die if you charisma goes down? Do you get so ugly that people kill you or the gods smite you with their Ugly Stick +10 or what?).
Anyway, hitting him is pretty hard. I guess the best way to beat him is get him tangled up in high-strenth stat summons (Earth Elementals for example or even Monster Summoning III for orgre berserkers with a 18/00 strength) so they last longer.

I don't personally like battles like these because they tend to be really buggy because there's so many globals or something. For example the Ascension final battle rarely works for me, which makes me mad. For this one, I beat the first round, then nothing happened. I was supposed to see the lightning bolt dealie, but it never came.
Power Word: Reload!

I know that re-requipping your strength-boosting items will not overcome the strength drain, but has anyone ever tried casting Strength to see if it resets the stat to 18/50 (or the cleric spell Strength of One, which sets the group strength to 18/76)? It just occurred to me while reading MC's last post, so maybe I haven't thought it through all the way. It would certainly be an interesting way to resurrect that spell.

Chuggin down a Potion of **** Strength works, but only once. After that, you have to wait for the strength drain to wear off.

Right, I forgot about that. Anyone have input on the spell idea? I know that Wrath has a freakish THAC0, but with enough strength boosters and a revolving door of tanks, you might be able to take him toe to toe without casualties.

Not even Mirror Image helps. The STR drain just blows right past it.

Anyhoo, I just finished the Ritual quest, and I must say it was fun. I liked how you can't rest at all. All you're guys are lvl drained or something, not to mention wounded and fatigued, but you still gotta fight some freakin' huge-ass golems. I'm just wondering, how do you interupt the Ritual without killing the Countess?

But I have one question. What's with the amulets? Aren't they wayyyyy overpowered? Plus you get 6! I like the Yellow Dragon armour though. Looks kooky. Especially with Prot. from Evil on.

I was actually a little disappointed with the ritual quest. The grove was a little too "paint by numbers," and I grew bored and frustrated with it. I was really looking forward to the challenge, which sounded like the best part of the mod, but in the end I just brute-forced the encounter. I might take a fresh look at it some day, because on paper it *still* looks really attractive to me.

By contrast, I really enjoyed fighting Pontifex. He blew me away the first time I fought him, until I realized that you had to really clobber him--no holding back. The golems mixed things up nicely, and caused no end of grief to my magic-heavy group (I didn't even have Crom Feyr, so I had to put the rod of smiting to work).

Just to clarify, do you mean to say that if Wrath hits one of your mirror images, you suffer a strength drain? That doesn't sound right to me.

Yeah. Jan died because I thought I could get him to absorb all of Wrath's hits, but he up and killed him, even though I was pumping out Mirror Image illusions like nothin'.

BTW, do those Lillith Amulets you get cause your character to berserk every once in a while?

Huh. I wonder if it's because of his anti-magic sphere. I never noticed that before.

Yeah, the amulets are cursed. I never use them, but they sure are pretty.

About the strength drain...what if you wear a Belt of "insert giant name here" strength?

AFAIK, there was this bug, where you wear a Ring of Human Influence, and keep using your Rod of Terror, till your Charisma drops BELOW 0. Remove the ring, and you get 25 Charisma.

If that is true...then this should be true of Strength with a belt of something or the other strength as well...shouldnt it?

I mean, if you wear an item which SETS the stat to something, strength drain shouldn't affect it.

If it does, however...they're cheating, so you might as well cheat back at them and CTRL+Y the suckers. :D

@ faraaz

well, i remember trying to use a "your fave giant" - strengt belt against those lovely revenge spiders that come along with solaufein, but i didn't work at all ... had to make up different strategies :hmm:

Yeah, this already got briefly covered earlier in the thread (MC and I went back and forth quickly for a while there). Reequipping strength enhancing items does not fix strength drain. Hence Beren's input on potions and my question about using spells.

Just to clarify about the Lillith amulets, I think I've figured out the disadvantage. Whenever a character gets hit and wounded, there's a certain % chance of him going berserk, just like Minsc's ability (+2 to STR, DEX and CON, +2 to THAC0 and Dmg I think, special immunties, etc.)

So far that's it.

That risk accumulates, or atleast it seems like it. So the longer you wear them the bigger the risk for berserk.

@Nightwood, Eric: Hmph. Sucks to be Charname then... :D :D :D

Just to give this a bit of a bump, I just soloed a FMT through Jon's dungeon, which was a whole new level of detailed battle planning. I was certain that Rasputin was going to be the worst, and that I would have to get a lucky hit with the hold person scroll from level 2, but I was wrong. A warm-up backstab and 1 oil of speed made him the easiest of the group. Illych can't be backstabbed, so he was pretty vile--had to get my AC down to -6 with the Blur scroll, draw his fire, and then use the Monster Summoning I scroll to bring in artillery support. That Ogrillon dished a good 30 damage I'd say. That fight would have been easier if I'd drawn Karamazov first, since his full plate would have dropped my AC to -9. Anyway I roughed up Karamazov with a backstab, then used the scroll of Invisibility and backstabbed him again. After that he went down fast. The glabrezu was nasty since I'd used all my healing potions and his AC is terrific, but he was the easiest to isolate of all--he can see through your hide in shadows, but he doesn't dispel your invisibility, so he chases you and the rest of them stay behind.

So my FMT walked out of Jon's dungeon at 7/8/9 and 8 hp, leaving alive 3 badly wounded duergar proletariat that I couldn't break apart and the vampire.

That might have finally satisfied my desire to experiment with Improved Illych. I'm not sure there is anything else to prove there, unless someone thinks it can be done with a "lesser" class.

dear mother of god.

I'll confess that I am a total Tactics junkie, but I did have some purpose behind this madness. I've always been disappointed that some people on this board seem to think that Tactics is impossible or requires cheating. But if you can solo it, you must be able to beat it straight up with a group of 5, right? At least I hope that's what people think when they read that last post of mine.

Oh, I should have mentioned, no resting. I was finished in about 16 hours of game time. That's another one of my pet peeves. You don't have to rest to get through Improved Illych.

What it sounds like Tactics requires is a level of obsession with the game that most players will never come close to ;)

I've played through the game a number of times, and my tactics are getting pretty refined (my current goal is to make it through the game without needing a reload), but I doubt I could solo a F/M/T through the standard dungeon without resting. Hell, a party of mine usually rests twice before getting out.

How many reloads did you need? I'm wondering if you reloaded until your Monster Summoning I scroll produced an Ogrillon, as opposed to, say, a rabid dog...

Guilty: I am obsessed. What can I say. :)

I had to reload a few times on Illych but not because of the specific monster I got--he is MUCH more powerful than you are. He kept smashing me, although now I'm pretty sure I can kill him repeatedly with this method--provided I don't get a bad run of luck. I managed to save up 5 potions of extra healing, but I only needed to use 3. Also, I had a scroll of fireball that I was planning on using, but the Ogrillon did much better than I expected. So there was a fair amount of room for error in that battle.

As for the summon, I was actually hoping for 3 kobold archers, but indeed the dog would have been a disappointing summon. Still, it should have been enough for 10-15 damage (2-3 hits, it's a long battle). But the real place where I expected to use a lot of reloads (as I mentioned) was Rasputin. His stunning fist = instant death, but by a great stroke of luck he never managed to stun me.

Without resting? Are you totally insane?! Holy freakin crap! I'm depressed now because I know for a fact I'd NEVER be able to do that ****.

Here's the thing, MC. When you play through the normal game (unmodded), you walk out of Jon's dungeon weighed down with treasure that you sell or save for future use. But when I'm finished with a run through the Tactics version, I don't have anything left. No scrolls, frequently no arrows, no spells left for Imoen or Jaheira (or the PC, if you play as a sorcerer or know to fill your spellbook as a mage/wild mage). My first time through, everyone had less than 10 hp left and if a pack of kobolds attacked I would have died. That's what I love about the mod--that is exactly the kind of drama that I think should go into getting out of Jon's dungeon. Of course, now that I've refined my skills, I have no trouble getting out with a fairly healthy party--which is why I tried the solo. Now that I've succeeded in that, I think I could stroll out with a party. But the thing is, it's really just a matter of practice (and obsession, I suppose). Anyone can do this, if they put in the time.

BTW, just for kicks I went back and freed Minsc and Jaheira after I cleared the place out. They kept telling me it was too dangerous to split up, and refused to believe that our jailers were all dead. I hope they didn't run into those wounded Duergar on the way out...

You must have rested once to memorize your spells in the first place ;) :p

First of all, the game "rests" you right at the beginning, when Irenicus is talking to you. That's why a sorcerer starts with all his spells. A straight up magic user (or cleric), though, has not yet selected spells for his spell book. He/she "rests," but gains no benefit from this. However, if you pause the game while it's on the black screen before you talk to Jon, you can access your spell book, choose spells, and then "rest." This is what I hinted at in my last post when I mentioned knowing how to fill your spellbook before the game starts.

Second, because I was using the splint mail, I only used one fireball spell (on the greater otyugh). I had planned on using a mirror image before the battle with Illych, but there was never enough time to take off the armor, cast the spell, put the armor back on, and enter battle. So I actually walked out of Jon's place with a decent array of spells, which I still don't use too much (now that I'm wearing full plate).

Its not so much the difficulty that i hate about tactics, its the cheese. Not cheese thats required to win, but cheese used against me.

I figured I'd just mention two more things before I forget about them. The first is that I kinda got screwed with the key wands. Frequently one of the goblins in the hallways surrounding the greater otyugh room drops a scroll of identify. This time around that didn't happen, and my lore wasn't high enough to id any of the wands. That meant I couldn't use the monster summoning wand, which would have been an enormous help. That makes me think that a bard character might have a high enough starting lore to id all of the wands, and that might be enough firepower to take on the Illych gang. Just in case anyone wants to solo a bard. :)

Second, the greater otyugh might have been the hardest fight in the dungeon. Between the dolorous decay and the poison, there is enough damage to kill you outright. In addition, you can get slowed, and you *must* kill it before the carrion crawler shows up. There was a moment where I was pretty sure I'd have to sneak past him and draw up a new strategy for fighting Illych's gang, since I usually use the otyugh room as my base of operations. But a preemptive fireball, a backstab, and a little bit of luck got me through.

By the by, Improved Mae'Var was much easier than I expected. Invisibility and detect illusions turned it into a rout.