I picture that paints a thousand words...

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40716000/jpg/_40716791_sun203ok.jpg

His drinking does'nt bother me, in fact I'll quite happliy join him. Soft drugs is no big deal either, although he is on his own there, I'll stick to the drink :beer: .

Harry dressing up as a Nazi, even in fancy dress just strikes me as stupidity beyond belief. He probably could not have picked a worse disguise, and even as someone who nis not interested in the Royals, I cannot believe he can be that that stupid. He's even selling copies of the Sun :lol: .

He has to remember that he could be the future King of England. I have some sympathy with him battering photographers, I have some sympathy that he is always in the public spotlight. I have little sympathy with him needing to cheat in his school exams. I have no sympathy for any idiot that puts on Nazil regalia regardless of the circumstances.

If it would have been me I would have been sacked, no question. Harry is only young and will make mistakes, but this one is by far his worst yet...

What a clown that boy is.

Last I checked, the British royal family only bred for Hemophilia, not intelligence . . .

Well if he was going to dress up as a Nazi he should have atleast done it in style. That costume looks extremely cheap and like something he made himself. One would think that a prince of the royal family could afford something better. The idea in itself is stupid enough too though.

What I'd like to know is: who else knew about this? Was *everyone* else completely ignorant?

Regardless, this act is crass beyond belief. Harry's an idiot.

Wondering how soon the press will recall that the British royals are actually German. :rolleyes:

Rarrrrr, saxon invaders.

Who cares? It was just a costume party and not the Political Conference of the Century. True, he could had chosen a bit more wisely, but the sky hasn't fallen yet, has it? :rolleyes:

Nightlight: Not Saxons, the Saxon nobility were pretty much all displaced by the Normans (French/Danes). The current monarchy is German from the 19th century.

Oh, the sky has fallen in the UK over this, and hard... Stupid is ok and expected from the royal family on a regular basis (poor Harry's had plenty of crazy genes down the family tree). But insultingly stupid - that's a major no-no.

Really, idiot is a fitting description of him. Either he's living so far from reality that he has completely no idea what's acceptable for someone in his position, or he simply doesn't give a rat's about it. But either way he's stupid - if for nothing else, because he got in a load of trouble over it with the royal family and many other people and organizations. Anyone with any common sense would rather avoid that.

How precisely is wearing a Nazi uniform insulting? He's not going around condoning their actions. Clearly he made a bad choice in choosing a costume for a private function, but the whole thing is being blown entirely out of proportion by tabloids who've been desperate for a good scandal after being forced to report real news for a while with the tsunami.

Harry's activities tend to be blown out of proportion by the gutter press. Private Eye do a great job of satirising this, running headlines like 'Revealed: 19 year old has girlfriend' or '18 year old drinks too much and gets into a fight shocker.'

I have less sympathy with the ginger one in this case. Regardless of the story behind this the mere fact that he wears the Nazi symbol is going to piss off an awful lot of people. 6 million people from this country died fighting the Nazis. The Nazis believed that Jews, Blacks, Communists, the elderly and the disabled (there are many British people who fall under one or more of these categories) were unfit to live.

This forum amuses me sometimes. There are people on here who cry 'political correctness has gone mad' every time anyone takes offence at anything, regardless of the nature of the incident. I mean, what is this country coming to when a prominant meber of our Royal family can't dress up as a Nazi without a few people grumbling. Yes, our country is surely mad!

Mind you, he does have German blood...

The article I read said the costume shop he got the uniform from also had an SS uniform. At least he didn't chose the latter.

Imagine the scandal when they discover "Rammstein" on his iPod.

As for being German, if his family hadn't changed their names repeatedly, and followed the patrilineal line, his name would be Harry Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glücksburg.

But my favorite is still the "king" of Bulgaria, Simeon Sakskoburggotski (an attempt at bulgarianizing Saxe-Coburg-Gotha).

Two wars and the Germans still run Europe...

Midwinter - good point, someone else must have known.

Wildfire - all that matters is that he should have been aware that his actions would be perceived by others as being insulting. He should be well aware of what the tabloids will blow out of proportion.

I hope you are taking the piss, Bion...

Well, ok, maybe with the Germans running Europe, and I have no idea what's on Harry's iPod...

As for the SS uniform: (http://www.thisislondon.com/til/jsp/modules/Article/print.jsp?itemId=15942991)

It emerged that Harry hired his costume at a shop close to Highgrove, Maud's Cotswold Costumes, popular with the young royals and their set.

Among the other outfits which were said to have caught the prince's eye was a SS uniform.

Maud Franklin, 78, who runs the shop, said: "My shop is popular with young royals.

"They normally go for more specific themes or something outrageously silly like a chicken outfit." So obviously there's a market in London for such attire...

Otherwise: the very long last name was officially the last name of Prince Phillip's father, Prince Andrew of Greece and Denmark (later deposed), who married a Princess Alice of Battenburg, whence the name "Mountbatten." (The Bulgarian "king" with the funny name is no doubt related somehow.)

As for having a piss, as a yank I reserve the right to roll my eyes at the public misadventures of the Euro royals. For us across the pond, this kind of thing reads like the politics version of professional wrestling. Our media, on the other hand, is far more concerned with important issues, like the breakup of Brad and Jen...

The royal family has been German since 1715, when George of Hanover assumed the throne, primarily because the Stuarts, the "rightful" kings, were incredibly inept even by the standards of royalty, which God knows are not very high.

Perhaps it's time to retire the Royals, or at least bring back the Plantagenets.

Insulting, yes, there is no doubt about that. But the guy is just a kid and he probably thinks it looks cool to wear the symbol. He probably doesn't know the history behind it and if he did and took stock of his actions then I am sure he would not have. We all make mistakes at that age and it is not like he is a card carrying member of the S.S.. If he did this for a publicity stunt though, I hope the press crucify him. I am sure a good stint in the British army will make him grow up real fast and change his perspective a little.

But at least he's taking the heat off his brother...

Really, is it possible that he picked the costume to play to the Papperazzi and **** with them after they were instrumental in his mother's death? If I was him, I'd have armed body guards with orders to shoot papperazzi on sight!

Hmmm, I wonder if there would be the same outrage when a Native Mexican wears a conquistadors outfit?

It's only bad to wear a Nazi outfit because they lost war, yup.

His only mistake is that people take everything for an outrage.

Morgoth, personally I feel it's ok to dress up as nazi if the occation calls for it (i.e a costume ball with a military uniform theme) but as I remember reading an article about it, the theme of the party was colonial/native and I really don't understand what Nazis have to do with that. Besides he had to know his costume would draw attention.

As for the outrage. I would assume that wearing the dress of a spanish conquisador would be an outrage amongst the native Americans such as the nazi costume is an outrage in Britain.

Hmmm, I wonder if there would be the same outrage when a Native Mexican wears a conquistadors outfit?

It's only bad to wear a Nazi outfit because they lost war, yup.

His only mistake is that people take everything for an outrage. Are you bloody serious? Do you actually know what the Swastika represents?

Are you bloody serious? Do you actually know what the Swastika represents? Quite a lot actually. It was used by the Finnish airforce (before the rise of the nazis in Germany) and I believe it has something to do with religions in India too. It is a shame that the symbol has been tamished so that everywhere people see one they can only think of nazis.

Insulting, yes, there is no doubt about that. But the guy is just a kid and he probably thinks it looks cool to wear the symbol. He probably doesn't know the history behind it and if he did and took stock of his actions then I am sure he would not have.The thing is, this isn't your ordinary kid. He's supposed to have received the best education possible, and if he can still pull something like this knowing all that, you really have to wonder.

Morgoroth - you do know that the Nazi swastika is a mirror image of the Hindu swastika?

Either way, prince Harry is a public person and a major. He should behave like the two. If he doesn't like the constraints - let him leave the royal family (I think there is a procedure to renounce the royal name in such an occassion), they'll be better off, and his family will be better off.

Oh sure, he's young. But I'm young, too, and I never conduct in such a fashion. I might be aiming for an academic post in the future, and I know that such past might carry an effect. If Harry is too stupid to recognise that, he's unfit to rule, regardless of how such reign is limited - that's even worse - if he could ever have absolute power, he wouldn't care about the public opinion. Since he never will, he should behave like the people that pay for him* expect him to.
*) I know the royal family has enough private property (Queen Elizabeth II, as head of the family, is listed on the Forbes's Billionaires 100, with ca. $5 thousand million in holdings) to live off it even if they are forced to abdicate, but currently they are still supported by tax money.

I used to feel a bit sorry for him - the pressure of being under public scrutiny all the time. And when he got in a bit of trouble, well, I just chalked all the publicity up to the ridiculous obsession some people have over a completely out-of-touch, irrelevant and inconsequential "Royal" Family that has long out-lived its purpose.

This behaviour, however, is something different. All the more support for getting rid of the whole bunch of them.

@Barmy, as in the symbol for the regime that cost the lives of millions?

Is that your problem? The deportation and genocide of millions?

Sooooo, I guess when he came in a Chinese Communist outfit then he would be lynched right? No, because Germany is a lot closer than China(even though Mao murdered a lot more than Hitler), a genocide at a great distance is like 'Genocide? Oh, how terrible, well live goes on right?'.
If I told you that Turkey murdered over 2/3rd of a nation out and never apologized, would you gasp of horror when Prince whatishisname wore a Turkish Army uniform at a party? Would you?

Or is it because Germany deported and murdered millions of people AND Germany fought against England?
Well that makes it so much worse, doesn't it?

You're damn right it does.
You just simply do NOT go to a party dressed as a Nazi. Especially if you're someone in the public eye. It's just stupity in the extreme and is bound to offend tons of people. There is no contesting the point.

I don't care about China or Turkey, because that is not how Harry dressed. If he did go dressed like that, then there probably wouldn't have been as much uproar, simply because we never had much interaction with these and they don't get much coverage in the media. Although I would still expect a certain amount of moan.

However, that should not detract from this idiocy. Thousands and thousands of people died for this country in that war and he has just shat on them.

Yes I agree with you on that, as an important figure he should have known better.

Edit:

That he should have known better doesn't makes it his fault, chosing to be ignorant of something makes as much sense as chosing what to believe.

[ January 16, 2005, 18:46: Message edited by: Morgoth ]

Reasons? As it often is, public ignorance:
Ideology:
Nazism, Communism, or Imperialism for that matter, are sick ideologies. There's no contesting that.
Responsibility:
All are responsible for killing multitude of people.
Public knowledge:
Most people (in UK, at least) are taught about Nazism (it is involved with history of Britain), but not about Imperialism (far past), or Communism (far away). So whilst Communism is responsible for more murders than Nazism (in both relative and absolute numbers), and Imperialism in relative numbers, Nazism has arisen to be a symbol of evil, whilst neither Communism nor Imperialism have.

That, I think, explains it, because here in Poland, students at school are taught about both Hitler's Third Reich and Stalin's Soviet Union, and they are able to recognise both as evil.

One think is true about Communism, however - it had better propaganda and better artistry - whilst Nazism relied on older symbols (thus forever tainting the name of some of the most talented composers - Bach, Wagner, R. Strauss, to name but a few - writers, and painters as well), Communism aimed to create their own. This is reflected in today's designer apparel - people in the West tend to accept clothes with Soviet symbols, but here in Poland, most would be appalled.

(As a side note - if I was to be anti-Semitic, an interesting point comes up - Nazism is responsible for death of Jews, whilst neither Communism nor Imperialism seemed to be interested in judicide... Quite a conspiracy theory can be woven from that...)

chev -- it took about a day. I think what he did was pretty tasteless and shined a rather bright light not only on his stupidity, but his brother's as well. Can you even imagine the Royal Family's initial reaction in private? :D

For those of you who think it isn't such a big deal to show up on parties in a nazi uniform, you should give it a try in my neighbourhood, i give you about 30 seconds before the lynchmob gets you.

Just 30 seconds, I'd expect 5 seconds in jewish comunity. Regardless the fact that Harry wore that costume indicates that he's an idiot and we should pray that he NEVER get's the throne. Not very likely to happen after this mess.

For those of you who think it isn't such a big deal to show up on parties in a nazi uniform, you should give it a try in my neighbourhood, i give you about 30 seconds before the lynchmob gets you. The very first time I went to Amsterdam, many many moons ago, right after emerging from centraal station, the girl I was travelling with asked a middle aged guy working at the information kiosk how to get to "Rembrantplatz" and he bit her head off: "Plein! Plein! Not Platz! Plein!" And this was the guy they have to greet the tourists! :D

And one shouldn't underestimate the power Nazi propaganda had at that time; just because they pulled Bach, Wagner, etc into their cause, and they employed alot of classical imagery in their art and architecture doesn't mean they were old fashioned. On the contrary, they were very sophisticated and innovative with their use of media, from print to radio to tv. Hitler's favorite (neoclassical) architect did some amazing projects, an early kind of "virtual architecture, using lights (strangely enough, this was a precursor to the post 9/11 tower of lights in nyc), and his favorite director Leni Riefenstahl, was also very innovative in her use of editing, close-ups, mass ornament, etc. Sometimes people think Soviet propaganda was more artistic because of the importance art history gives to Russian Constructivism, or film history gives to Eisenstein, but Stalin marginalized these people right quick in favor of much less imaginative neoclassical Soviet realism.

Regardless of the rights and wrongs, he should have been well aware of all the dramas that his actions would cause. He must have known that all this storm would happen.

Excatly my thoughts, if there's one group of people who grow up with etiquettes, it's royalty. Yes, i think he gave it some good consideration, and then decided to step on some toes by wearing that uniform. Shows that royalty has their fair share of dumbasses too, it's not just the peasants. :D

Wisdom is not linked to what family you're born into. Sure it was in poor tase to wear that costume, but if it wasn't a royal wearing it, then it wouldn't have made a darned bit of difference. But no, it's a royal. News for a bloody month!

I think it's been blown totally out of proportion. It was a private party that the media shouldn't have been at. OK it was totally thoughtless in hindsight, but I'm sure it wasn't intended to offend and it wasn't as if he was idolizing Nazism. I've always treated fancy dress parties for what they are - to make fun of other peoples costumes and have them make fun of yours. Hardly propounding Nazi ideals is it?

Sidenote
I am guessing that the "colonial" aspect of the fancy dress theme was the fact it was an African Korps costume i.e. The German colonies in Africa.

And just to show one stupid idea deserves another, the EU justice commissioner Franco Frattini has said the EU may ban the use of Nazi symbols in Europe. So does that mean the Sound of Music will be banned? What about the West-end show "The Producers"? Indinanna Jones? Bye-bye certain episodes of Dad's Army, Fawlty Towers, and other British comedy's. Not to mention all the old war films. All of these have a depiction of the Swastika somewhere in them.
Sheesh, banning something being shown is like trying to sweep in under the carpet and pretend in never happened. Much better to hold it up to ridicule and stop it ever happening again.

Well, i'm pretty sure it WAS his intention to offend, because that's what Harry likes, being an attention seeking little prick. And what better way to get attention then to dress up as a nazi ?

And i'm sure those tv shows will be left unharmed. There a difference between watching it on tv in films and docus, or when someone actually starts parading in such a costume right in front of you.

Carcaroth, surely you realize that there's a difference between banning murder and banning all films that depict murder scenes? Well, the same applies here. The public display of symbols related to NS is prohibited in Germany. Nevertheless, we haven't swept anything much under the carpet but rather dealt with it - in some way or other.

Besides, there's not much about the NS times that I find ridiculous.

Right. That should be enough of being goody-two-shoes for the next two months. I'll go for something more non-pc and sinister next time...

Pac-man
Could you substantiate your statement please? Name an incident when Harry has intentionally done something bad in order to gain media attention. I couldn't think of any so I went throught the BBC news archives for the past 6 years.
Before this particular episode his infractions have included:
:- Under aged Drinking and Smoking Canabis. Big deal he was a teenager, probably 90% of his age group had drunk underage and 50% smoked cannabis. It sure as hell wasn't his idea to have it publicised.
:- Teacher claimed she had done his A-level coursework. Definitely not the Prince trying to gain attention this time.
:- A scuffle with the paparazzi when he was actually because he was pissed off they were trying to put him in the news.

The only times he has actually gone for big publicity media events is for charitable works when trying to carry on Diana's work. In Australia he threatened to leave the country on his gap year as the media wouldn't leave him alone.

Darkthrone.
I know there is a difference between the two, but I don't trust the EU to. There are too many stupid laws they have formed to give me any confidence in their ability to moderate themselves. Classics include the minimum length of a cucumber and the maximum bend in a banana. Please recall we are not talking about a public display of Nazi symbolism in Harry's case but a private party. (Incidently the Sun was banned from covering media events of Harry and William in April last year)
I agree there is not much ridiculous about the actual History of Nazism. However, when you ban something you make it that more appealing to a certain brand of people - in this case generally young skin head tough guys with more testosterone than brain cells. Ban it publically and it goes underground. How many things that have been banned have actually disappeared? What about "The Satanic Verses", by all accounts a very poor book but a best seller because of the Islamic response. Or the BBC's ban on Relax by Frankie Goes to Holywood which immediately made it a hit in the British charts for a year? Ridicule something, poke fun at it and it loses it's "tough guy" and rebel appeal.
I can't comment on how Germany deals with nazi's or neo-nazis but found this article (going back a few years though) http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/1364876.stm
Can it honestly be said that banning public displays of symbols would have any effect on membership of such groups? Or does it just make people feel safer because they don't know how many people might feel that way?

And just to show one stupid idea deserves another, the EU justice commissioner Franco Frattini has said the EU may ban the use of Nazi symbols in Europe. So does that mean the Sound of Music will be banned? What about the West-end show "The Producers"? Indinanna Jones? Bye-bye certain episodes of Dad's Army, Fawlty Towers, and other British comedy's. Not to mention all the old war films. All of these have a depiction of the Swastika somewhere in them.Now that would be awful. And yes, the Comission has done various weird things and nothing would be surprising from them.

Sheesh, banning something being shown is like trying to sweep in under the carpet and pretend in never happened.Yeah, exactly what I think.

It looks like those pharaohs ordering the names of their less liked predecessors scratched out of monuments. To ban any mention of something looks exactly like that. As Cicero said, to be ignorant of history is to remain a boy forever. If we don't learn from our previous mistakes, we will make them again.

[ January 18, 2005, 15:18: Message edited by: chevalier ]

Of course they don't mean tv shows, movies, books, etc... why would he even mention that ? But openly wear swastikas or nazi uniforms is a totally different matter, how hard can it be to understand that ? Those things belong in a museum, not on the streets, or on parties. Surely Harry must have known this too, but still decided to wear it. Says a lot about his personality, doesn't it ?

If the banning would include tv programs and books and such, it would be an insane demand, but if it prevents people from presenting themselves in public with stuff like that, i'm all for it.

Pac man -- it's something else to openly promote something, or show tolerance for it (as p. Harry did), and it's something else to depict it to show.

but if it prevents people from presenting themselves in public with stuff like that, i'm all for it.Problem is -- it doesn't. People forget. We forget. We no longer remember how terrifying the Cold War was. A generation after such a ban emerges and EU splits over nationalistic ambitions.

Besides -- censoring or banning intellectual creation instead of polemics (how ironic! 'poleme' is Greek for 'war') opens straight path to 'only correct' literature, meaning ideological propaganda spilling straight into the minds of -- especially -- children.

Ban swastikas? What would be next? It's already illegal in France to wear religious (or even perceived as religious) symbols in the public. It's not illegal to dress in misdemeaning manner (there's no misdemeanor to even name such outfit), but it is illegal to wear a religious symbol. What's next? Will it be illegal to be even slightly tanned?
Returning to literature, what will be censored and/or banned after Nazi symbols? Music (my pot of pie) which can be associated with Nazism? Sorry, but Bach, Wagner and R. Strauss will stay in their place -- on my shelves. Maybe all religious inclinations in any book Regardless of the context, regardless of whether praising or denouncing religion -- to remain completely "neutral?" Or maybe ban only the books praising religion (including the Bible)? Sure, then they'll have a 'neutral' outlook on the literacy market.

Those things belong in a museum, not on the streets, or on parties.Sorry, but they belong on the streets. What I mean is that everyone should be reminded -- even constantly -- about what it represents. If they stay in the museum, only those that go there will see them. And only if they want to. People don't want to think about what they don't like think about. Out of their own volition they will not think about it. Besides, we are a forgetful lot. We don't like to remember about things we don't like to think about...

That he [prince Harry] met with public criticism for his demeanor is reassuring. What is not reassuring, however, is that there is no ban in the EU on the representation of hammer & sickle -- symbols of the regime that took away possessions, liberty, and life of many more individuals than Nazism did. And I'm talking about only the Stalin era vs. Hitler era in the Third Reich...

Well personally I find symbols to be insignificant. I do not care what symbols people wear on the street. It's their right to have on them whatever symbols they want. Of course I would not wear the swastica because I would think it is inappropriate but if someone wants to look like an idiot on the street (or a party like our little prince here) then fine let them.

If you start forbidding symbols you might as well forbid the Belgian flag or the name Leopold for the massacre Leopold II caused in Kongo, which according to some studies even exceed the number of deaths caused by Hitlers holocaust. Forbidding the use of the Christian Cross might also be in order since it was used as the symbol of the massacres in America by Spaniards and the Portugese. The Russian flag also should be forbidden because of the misdeeds of Ivan the Terrible, and the French Tricolor because of Napoleon.......

But even if they did ban the public display of nazi insignia - would Harry have done anything illegal? I mean this was a private event, and there is something vaguely sinsiter about the government proscribing one's attire in private.

That said, my theory is that his grandad put him up to it. :1eye: It's been a while since Philip caused a nice scandal, so maybe he's moving into more sinister Iago-like methods of international incident by proxy :) How's that for a conspiracy theory?

Exactly, Morogoth, It's not the symbl that's bad, it's the deeds. Wearing a swastika is nothing. Killing millions of people for arbitrary reasons is bad!

OK. You're all right. And wrong. Of course, wearing a swastika is not killing anyone. Spitting on the ground in front of a black or gay man is not killing anyone. Pissing on the grave of Jews is not killing anyone. Calling a handicapped person names is not killing anyone.

Is spitting on the ground a symbol or a deed? It may well depend on your point of view. Is wearing a swastika a deed? An insult maybe? To millions of people all over the world? Hell, yes, it is! Just because you don't feel insulted doesn't mean that it is not in any way insulting to anyone whatsoever.

"Those symbols belong on the streets ..." Huhuhu, hahaha. :bs: Please tell me how exactly someone who proudly wears the symbols of nazism and displays nothing in terms of comprehension of the cruel deeds of this period is reminding anyone of our dark history. Those who already know learn nothing new. Likewise those who have never known anything.

No one is speaking about banning the Third Reich from our history books.

Germany has banned those symbols for 50 years now. Go ahead, test your theory. Are there more Germans who have forgotten about WWII and nazism than, say, Englishmen? Or Scots? Or Poles? Tsktsktsk.

And at the same time you display understanding of why anyone may feel insulted by a swastika. Because you feel insulted by the insignia of Stalin. And yet you are not able to abstract. Sad.

Talking about hammer and sickle may well be worth the effort - but Harry didn't dress as Stalin's guard of honor. He tried to impersonate Erwin Rommel or somesuch. In this regard I find the reaction of the EU more obvious, I must say.

Could it be that you're reflexively biting against anything the EU spills forth rather than arguing according to your consciousness?

OK. You're all right. And wrong. Of course, wearing a swastika is not killing anyone. Spitting on the ground in front of a black or gay man is not killing anyone. Pissing on the grave of Jews is not killing anyone. Calling a handicapped person names is not killing anyone. There is a big difference between wearing a swastika and all those things below. In wearing the swastika you are not directing your insult towards a specific person in the rest of those cases you are doing that. In Finland it's not even illegal to insult a specific ethnic group but if you happen to insult someone specific then you're committing a crime.

Is spitting on the ground a symbol or a deed? It may well depend on your point of view. Is wearing a swastika a deed? An insult maybe? To millions of people all over the world? Hell, yes, it is! Just because you don't feel insulted doesn't mean that it is not in any way insulting to anyone whatsoever. The fact that some people happen to feel insulted by something I wear is not my problem. Let them feel insulted. Wearing the mask of Osama bin Laden might be very insulting to some in America but was not illegal the last time I checked.

There is a big difference between wearing a swastika and all those things below. In wearing the swastika you are not directing your insult towards a specific person in the rest of those cases you are doing that. Ask any survivor of the holocaust if he feels an insult of that kind is directed at him or not. It's not for you to decide, isn't it.

The fact that some people happen to feel insulted by something I wear is not my problem. True. And true for anything else, starting from dying children in Palestine and ending with genital mutilation in Africa. Oh, and your neighbor beating his children. Nothing is really your problem. It's a good thing you are completely autarkic. I envy you, cause I'm not.

Oh, and Harry didn't do anything illegal, that's for sure. We're talking legitmacy and decency here. And how this might lead to illegality as well.

Ask any survivor of the holocaust if he feels an insult of that kind is directed at him or not. It's not for you to decide, isn't it. No it is not, but it's not for him to decide what I wear either is it?

Oh, and Harry didn't do anything illegal, that's for sure. We're talking legitmacy and decency here. And how this might lead to illegality as well. Decency and legimacy have a big difference indeed.Just because something is undecent it doesen't mean that it should be illegal. I consider wearing the swastika undecent but definently not something that should ever be illegal.

No, you're right, they should all start wearing swastikas in public, without shame. That way i have a clearer view of the target.

Decency and legimacy have a big difference indeed.Just because something is undecent it doesen't mean that it should be illegal. I consider wearing the swastika undecent but definently not something that should ever be illegal.I agree with Morgoth! *shock* :p

The title says it all: he's an idiot. And yes, he did, by wearing that uniform, **** on a lot of brave men who died to defeat everything that uniform stood for, not to mention the many innocent English men, women, and children who died under the bombs dropped by planes bearing that symbol. (Yes, yes, many more Germans died later under Allied bombs. When the German Chancellor attends a party wearing a Union Jack armband, post it.) He might also have reflected on the fact that if the Nazis had won, his grandmother would be lying in an unmarked grave with a bullet in the back of her head.

**** on a lot of brave men who died to defeat everything that uniform stood for Bull, first nobody except the top-Germans knew the Jews were slaugtered, everyone knew Jews were oppressed, did anyone care??
No! Because that was happening for thousands of years, even Churchill had problems with everything that wasn't white brittish, oh the sheer racism *cry*

And if somebody is gonna call me an ******* because I take a **** on their sacrifices, remember that anyone who says they died for *defeating what the Nazis stood for* is taking a **** on their sacrifices.
Apparently, their original sacrifice, dieing because they had too, dieing to free europe, wasn't enough, you had to add the other thing to make their sacrifice seem worthwhile..

Ok, this is getting too personal, so please tone it down.

Ah, yes, as usual, the tabloids report that there has been a "fury" and a "public outcry" regarding some total non-story, whilst everyone else in the country doesn't really give a damn.

Awfully stupid thing for him to do, though. I think Prince Phillip is training him up as his apprentice or something.

Good god, I hope nothing ever happens to William. He'd be a really quite abominable King.

I have to say that my post was just a second reply--I made another one earlier--to the original question, after I'd thought about it a bit.. I hadn't read any of the other posts on this topic, and still haven't, deliberately.

[ January 25, 2005, 10:59: Message edited by: Cernak ]

Bull, first nobody except the top-Germans knew the Jews were slaugteredI realize this is off-topic, but...

No. That's incorrect.

Before anyone jumps on this - open a new thread if you want to discuss it.