Hopefully this is the correct forum for this thread. I think it's serious enough of a topic that it doesn't belong in whatnots.

My question is this: There are many words that I, as an American use, that people in other English speaking countries have completely different words for. The purpose here is two-fold. First, to attempt to get as comprehensive a list of these things together as possible, and secondly to try and figure out why these words are so different. Most of my examples are based on British/American differences, but I'm also aware of a few Autralian/American differences. I'm sure there's also Australian/British differences, although I am not in a position to be aware of many. I'll start out with a few obvious ones, feel free to add:

American version: Gasoline. British version: Petrol.

American version: Soccer. British version: Football.

American version: Sausages. British version: Bangers.

How about an American/Australian difference now? If you're using a charcoal-based fire to cook something, what do you call the cooking instrument?

American version: Grill. Australian version: Barbie.

A little bit of pop culture now. If you are really happy with something...

American version: Cool. British version: Brilliant.

I'm as much interested in examples as I am with possible explanations. I can understand the use of "petrol" as I'm assuming it's short for petroleum, and what we Americans refer to as gasoline is, after all, a petroleum-based product. I also will admit that the rest of the world's definition of "football" is more accurate than the American version of the sport. The rest leave me scratching my head.

Car Trunk = Boot
Car Hood = Bonnet
Eraser = Rubber
French Fries = Chips (what do the English call Lay's chips?)

I think when people are separated their languages will always begin to diverge. Spanish in Mexico is almost a different language than Spanish in Spain (though they can converse with each other).

What I find fascinating is something that I was told, but never absolutely confirmed, and that is that the major Chinese dialects pronounce words almost completely differently, and cannot verbally communicate with each other (unless of course one party speaks both dialects), but that the written language is the same or so similar that they can communicate by writing. :cool:

Some of those words you have used are just slangs. Like 'bangers' and 'barbie'.
A 'grill' is part of a cooker (indoor), that is used to grill toast, some meats and other things. A 'barbeque' is something that is outside when the weather is good; cooked using charcoal etc. and shared with a few beers. I think that's quite an international word for it (except maybe the US, who just HAVE to be different). 'Barbie' is just an slang abbreviation.

Also 'cool' isn't 'brilliant' in English? We use cool. We also use things like 'nice one', 'proper', 'class', 'buzzin', 'laughin', et cetera, et cetera.

The words that stand out for me in this are 'sweater', 'sneakers' and 'pants'. These words Americans seem to fangled together and use when they mean 'jumper', 'trainers' and 'trousers'.

Personally, I think Americans have tried to change our language to try and give themselves more national identity. Damn colonials ;) .

Also, Darkwolf, your 'chips' are crisps here. Plus, I think Lays are called Walkers here, as well...

Well, Spanish can be very different in many countries, check this:

Car: auto (Argentina)
coche (Spain)
carro (Colombia)

Boy / Kid: pendex, muchacho (Argentina)
chaval (Spain)
chavo (Mexico)
chico (Ecuador)

And there are a lot more.

American: cell phone, British: mobile

American: steal, Aussy: pinch, British: nick

@ Darkwolf - you are completely correct in your statement about China. There are literally over 300 different dialects in China, many of which are incomprehensible to someone who speaks a different dialect. Granted, many of these dialects are spoken by only small parts of the population, and aren't major dialects like Cantonese or Mandarin. However all of them use the same written language regardless of the local dialect. So yes, theoretically two people in China would have no means to communicate via spoken language, but could communicate by writing something down.

@Barmy

Barbeque in the US refers more to the type of food prepared, specifically using some type of barbeque sauce on the food. There are many things that we cook on a barbeque, but if they aren't prepared using barbeque sauce, we don't say they are barbequed, we say they are grilled. The small ovens we use to make toast are called toaster ovens.

The words that stand out for me in this are 'sweater', 'sneakers' and 'pants'. These words Americans seem to fangled together and use when they mean 'jumper', 'trainers' and 'trousers'. Evidently we have, as I am not sure what you mean by the English terms. I'll give you the US definitions for some of them:

Sweater - a heavy garment covering the upper half of your person. Usually only worn in winter, and typically made out of wool.

Sneaker - any sports-related footwear. White is by far the most popular color*, and they all have rubber soles.

Pants - any type of garment covering the bottom half of your body with the exception of jeans, which are refered to as jeans.

I don't know what jumpers or trainers are. Trousers are used interchangably with pants, although it is usually older people who favor the term trouser.

* That's another thing I realized - the different spelling of words: American: color. British: colour. Also flavor/flavour, armor/armour. The other common one is the use of an "s" instead of a "z", such as in specialized/specialised.

American: Aluminum, British: Alueminium (wierdoes)

British: Herb, American: (h) Erb... (to quote a comic...because there is a *ucking "H" in it)

To further suppport Barmy, my fellow countryman, we don;t call sausages 'bangers'. They're sausages, and have been since the 1950s.

ANyway, during the holidays, an american guy asked me if I was an Aussie.

*Angered sigh* No, this is an english accent. SHall I don a beefeater's outfit and adopt a cockney accent?

COr blimey guvner!

Here's a couple I noticed in the american lace I stayed over summer:

Brit American
biscuit- cookie
Nappy- Diaper
Pavement- Sidewalk
Pram- Buggy


Oh yeah, and the chips-fries thing annoys me. Especially when the burger king guy tried to sell me 'freedom fries'. That arguement lasted five or ten minutes.
Still, he understood what I mean by an 'Irish' milkshake. (Whiskey!)

To clarify LNT,

If it's something you are cooking with, yes, it's spelled herb, but the "h" is silent, so phonetically it's "erb".

However, some people are named Herb - short for Herbert. In this case, the "H" is pronounced.

One more I came up with: American: Vacation. British: Holiday. In the US, a holiday is something that is celebrated nationally, things like Thanksgiving, New Years Day, etc., whereas a vacation is some place you visit for a week or so, usually in the summer.

What 'bout canadianism? Seriously the only word that is truly english canadian is :

Eh? which is about '' what? ''

Seriously you heard it all the time :)

@Daie - we do use the term "pavement" but that's what we would use to refer to the black covering on the street, not the sidewalks.

British: /he:b/, American: /e:rb/

And "aliminum" is what's really weird. The rest of the world calls it "aluminium". :p

It's because the founder of the American Aluminum (sic) Company couldn't spell. :lol:

Almost got myself in trouble in Toronto once...

After a long working day (it was around midnight), I got a little creative on my drive home (no one was coming the other way, screw the stop sign), and was spotted doing so by the local police, who pulled me over.

The cop asks me "Hey, are you pissed?" and at first I think he's asking me if I'm upset with myself for running the stop sign, so I say, "uh... yeah," and he says, "So you're pissed then are you," and it finally dawns on me that he's asking me if I've been drinking!

Finally got off with a warning...

If anyone has a chemistry book and is from England, I would love to know how it is spelled.

Do English people say platinium?


Edit...

American: Mayo, British: Breakfast, Lunch, Dinner, Snack...

OK, I'm done...just poking, I'll stop...

@LNT: That there is an "i" in aluminium doesn't mean that there should be one in "platinum". In Latin, aluminium is aluminium and platinum is platinum. "Aluminum" is just crappy Latin.

http://environmentalchemistry.com/yogi/periodic/Al.html#Names

Why does everyone think we eat loads of mayo? :pope:

Hmm, I stand corrected.


Barmy: I think it comes back to the mayo on chips (fries) thing...

Mayo on chips? Who the hell eats mayo on chips? :lol:

Salt and vinegar will do me squire, plus a little gravy if you've got any.

Well, clearly I have been misinformed on many accounts...

Mayo on chips? Who the hell eats mayo on chips?Belgians? ;) Sometimes I do, too, and my mother used to. But when I first saw that, I was horrified. :shake:

The thought of it certainly creates an imaginative shudder; probably why the rumor has become so widespread.

Brits ain't the only ones doing the mayo+chips= :yum: An American ex-friend of mine eats them that way. A woman I worked for used to put mayo in her coffee! :sick:

Other Brit words that are weird to me:

Brit-----Kuemper
===========
popping out - going outside
boot - trunk (really confusing watching Das Boot)
bonnet - car hood
fag - cigarette/bundle of sticks
cheerio (prob. not used anymore) - byebye
biscuit - cookie
crisp - chip
oleo - margarine (this doesn't bug me as my mom calls it oleo, too. :) )
lager - beer

And this driving on the 'right'/'wrong' side of the road business: what's up with that? So why do a majority of former Brit colonies drive on the 'wrong' (left) side?

Oh! How could we forget the whole "knock me up" and "stop by" thing?

So let me get this straight...do English people put mayo on their fries, or not?

I'm confused...

No, I can categorically (sp?... whatever) state that English people do NOT put mayo on chips (at least, the sane ones).
Most people drown them in vinegar and sprinkle some salt. In Northen England, we tend to let them swim in gravy. Mayo never comes into it. I think that's a European thing.

OK.

In NZ, we call it a rubbish bin, but in USA, you'd call it a trash-can. In England, you might call it a dust-bin.

Some of the differences can be shocking. In the USA, you can be served a dish called "Biscuits and Gravy" which sounds horrible, because for the rest of us, a biscuit is a what an American might call a "cookie".

I don't think anyone outside of the USA uses the word "condominium".

In NZ, we say "footpath", but in USA it might be a pavement or a sidewalk.

In NZ, we order a flat white (coffee with a little bit of foamed milk on top) but in other parts of the world that might be a cappuccino (which for us has lots of foamed milk) or a latte (which for us would be about 90% milk)

I had never heard of the words 'duplex' and 'semi-detached' to describe houses before I visited England.

I was ridiculed when I went to USA and asked for someone to pass me a 'rubber' to correct a mistake made in pencil. Apparently, that is what Americans call a condom. I should have asked for an eraser.

American: stockings or pantyhose
British: tights

A tear in said garment would be a run in America but a ladder in England.

In America, knickers are knee-length pants, usually worn by small boys but also as part of a fencing uniform. In British parlance, they're underwear for the lower half.

And while travelling where British is spoken, do yourself a favor and don't refer to your waist- or belt-bag as a fanny pack! :lol:

Yeah, that's why we always laugh that in America they actually have a sports team called the Knicker-bockers. Might as well call them the Underwear team.

Mayo on chips? Who the hell eats mayo on chips? The Dutch. Anyone who's dated a girl from Holland knows that. ;)

Schools:

NZ - American
Primary school - Elementary school
Intermediate school - Junior High
College - HigH School
University - College

Also, the whole deal with "freshmen" and "sophomores" etc is completely unheard of in NZ, other than something that goes on in American teen movies.

Yeah, that's why we always laugh that in America they actually have a sports team called the Knicker-bockers. Might as well call them the Underwear team.Hate to bring seriousness into this fun topic, but NY Knickerbockers are called that *because* they wore knickers (knee length pants) when they played. Will someone explain the driving thing to me?

Also, the whole deal with "freshmen" and "sophomores" etc is completely unheard of in NZ, other than something that goes on in American teen movies.I utterly hate that stuff with passion, though I can't tell you why. Perhaps because I generally don't like silly naming, perhaps because I generally hate silly words, perhaps because I generally hate the excessive urge that people seem to have. Don't know. But I hate those.

I think this may help answer your question Kuemper

http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a3_021b.html

I think there's some more school differences;
grade - year (as in year one instead of first grade)
kindergarten - reception

And let's not forget, arse is ass in Britain, unless you're refering to a donkey.

[ September 10, 2005, 04:08: Message edited by: Lost_Meme ]

It's still funny to have a serious sports team called the New York Underpants.

We drive on the left in NZ as well.

Expanding this topic a wee bit, we use the metric system in NZ, whereas USA and England do have something in common in that much of the old imperial measurement system is still popular in both of those countries.

Also, in NZ, we clean the floor with a 'vaccuum cleaner', not a 'hoover'.

And when we sell all our household junk, it is at a 'garage sale', not a 'yard sale' or a 'car-boot sale'.

Also, the whole deal with "freshmen" and "sophomores" etc is completely unheard of in NZ, other than something that goes on in American teen movies.I tend to call them "first-years" or "first year students".

Also we wear a raincoat; brits wear a mac.

There's also the issue of the pronounciation of words. To cut a funny story short, some guy asked me for "cheers." After he saw me stare blankly for a few seconds, he pointed to a nearby "chair."

I tend to call them "first-years" or "first year students"."Newbies" do just fine. And "fresh meet" sounds somewhat better than "freshmen". Well, just joking. :shake: But "sophomores" is weird. Really. Juniors, seniors, freshmen, not so bad. But sophomores? IIRC young academics are called households or something similar at some unis.

Sophomore can mean 'second', if you read the adjective definition.

American: cell phone, British: mobile malaysia: hand phone

The difference, i think, relates to its environment. Malaysia, obviously, has more people that knows some English than those who mastered English. "Hand" is an easy word for everyone, thus "hand phone" is adapted by the public.

Mayo on chips? Who the hell eats mayo on chips? The Dutch. Anyone who's dated a girl from Holland knows that. Exactly! That'd be us. Anybody who has seen Pulp Fiction could have known. :) There are more countries here who do, Belgians for example. The mayo in other countries is, of course, not as good as we Dutchies and Belgians use. No wonder they don't like it... :p

I always thought Americans used a bit more complex words, like 'elevator' for 'lift'.

@kuemper: Yeah, but only used about schools and students. It sucks. Plain "second-year" is way better IMHO.

i think, reading this that foreign people have an interesting idea of how british people speak

I did think some examples were silly, such as using English slang vs 'normal' words Americans use - such as Bangers and Sausages.

@chev - and the music industry and for the book writers... ;)

@ALdeth, okay? I'll call that asphalt, or tarmac.

And mayo on chips? German. Trust me, I live there.


In America, knickers are knee-length pants, usually worn by small boys but also as part of a fencing uniform.

Breeches dear lady, breeches.


@LNT: ALUMINIUM.
ANd we say Platinum.


@Kuemper- WHat the hell is oleo? We say margarine. And lager and beer are two seperate drinks. We say beer too. We make it better as well ;)


English Lesson over, back to my coursework. Adieu old beans!

Barbecue/Barbie/BBQ is really the method of cooking, though is often used to descibe the whole of the device used for doing this. The actual metal rack you put the food on is a Grille. A Grill is the device on the oven that radiates heat downwards, but also refers to the process of cooking under such.

I have been known to eat my chips with Mayonnaise, but only if I'm out of Tomato Sauce (Americanism being Ketchup).

Kuemper

UK common usage has Lager, Stout, Bitter and Ale as different types of Beer. Bitter is very similar to Ale, but has the addition of Hops. Lager is brewed at much colder temperatures and uses a different yeast to enable this. Stout requires roasting the barley and/or malts before use.

The British and colonies drive on the left hand side as it is the most sensible for the majority of drivers who are right handed. In addition, we were never conquered by the French.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driving_on_the_left
In reasons best known to himself, Napoleon decided to change the side of road that carts drove on, which is why the rest of the world are in the wrong. Oh sorry, this one had been answered already.

Both Stockings and Tights are used. Stockings are those that finish at the thigh, Tights cover the nether regions.

A Knicker-bocker Glory is an ice-cream

mayo on chips. Yummy. :p

And as for the real topic. The list is endless. And now you're only talking nouns. The irregular verbs also have that nasty habit. And We can't choose, oh no. The British version is the only correct version. Just as well actually. I like it much beter. :)

They even put in a really mean one in the exam. It was a part of the exam that was obviously about tenses, so everybody tries to find the right tense (we had to strike out the wrong one's) and then he puts "in jail" in one of the sentence. Now, I had a moment of great lucidity and immediately said "hah! gaol!, not jail" and I marked it as wrong, but very little of my classmates even noticed it.

Well, I *heart* English.

But both are permissible and appear in English dictionaries.

"Gaol" is classier. :p ;) But I like the "jail" one too. "Behind the bars" is how I enjoy putting it.

gaol is old old english

although you still see the term gaoler used when refering to prison guards

Most of this stuff is just slang developed into actual language, mis-spellings, or traditional stuff. What I really don't get is this whole football-soccer thing. How can you call it football if your foot hardly ever touches the ball? And what the hell is soccer?! The only thing I can think of is some derrivation of the phrase 'to sock' meaning to punch, but I think that phrase came about later anyway. Also, and I have no idea if the English have this problem as well, has anyone ever wondered why we park on driveways and drive on parkways? (insert corny heavy traffic joke here) There's a whole book on things like this called "Errors in English" (I think that's the one) that brings up stuff like this from America, England, Australia, Canada, and maybe a few other places. Its really hilarious. The thing I really worry about, though, is where we got 'burglarize' from. A burgaler is called a burglar because he burgles.

Sigh. At the risk of repeating myself, the word "soccer" is short for "Association Football" which is the official correct term for the sport, as denoted in the name of its governing body, FIFA (Federation Internationale de Football Association - i.e. the International Federation of Association Football). This helps distinguish it from Rugby Union Football, Australian Rules Football, American Football, Gaelic Football, or any other football that may be played in people's countries.

Also, NOG, I don't think the word 'parkway' is used much outside of the USA.

US: Sausages, UK: Bangers (but IIRC, only referred to as such when paired with mash), Australia: Snags

The "barbecue" thing is multi-purpose over here; it can refer to the cooking object, the cooking style (we have barbecued foods - normally taken from the cooking object), a variety of sauces, and to a food preparation which usually involves said sauces. It's a context thing.

The one I always found weird was the British use of "fit" referring to an attractive woman, as per "Fit But You Know It" and the Ali G movie. I get it, and like it, but am at a loss as to its origin. I'm a big fan of British rhyming slang, although wouldn't claim to understand it.

As Rallymama has said, fanny-packs have an entirely different meaning in the US than in the rest of the English-speaking world. Don't be offended if someone laughs at the use of the word.

Beer <> lager. IIRC, lager is a type of beer (along with ale and stout). No young Australian male should not be able to taste the difference, even if they don't understand the difference (stout's the easy one to spot).

Australia has some weird internal inconsistencies as well, mainly in football codes:

Footy - in Victoria, South Australia and Western Australia, refers to Australian Rules Football. The same code is known as "aerial ping-pong" in the northern states. In New South Wales and Queensland, refers to the dominant rugby code.

Rugby - catch-all term in Victoria; in NSW and Queensland, the distinction between union and league has to be made.

Soccer - soccer, everywhere in the country.

But both are permissible and appear in English dictionaries. My uni has this fun system. We have to know (and be able to distinguish between) both AE and BE, but only BE is correct.

but only BE is correct.As it should be! :thumb: ;)

Yup. No offence to the Americans/Australians , but the things you've done to that beautiful language...Especially the accent...

Y'all can kiss my grits! :lol:

Luckily, I don't have an accent.

Luckily, I don't have an accent.That's what everyone thinks! :shake: I don't mind the kiwi accent, though - some will tell you it's the same as Australian but minus vowels, but I don't believe 'em. Kiwi is softer and more palatable, imo.

Slighty off topic - I used never to understand why Americans got cockney and Australian confused... Now I live in London, and I understand: it's because 2/3rds of the people in London are from Oceania! :lol:

My accent used to be more Westcountry when I was small, but turned "typical" English when I went to private school. It's generally inadvisable to be thought of as a "wurzel" in life, though. People seem to underestimate anyone who has a Westcountry accent as being a bit thick. I think the same's true of Brummie, too.

I don't know why sounding posh makes people think you're clever, though - some of the dumbest people I've known have been among the poshest! One of them would even have sat in the Lords if they hadn't culled some hereditary peers... :eek:

@ Fel: wtf? :confused:

@Magpie:
Just a southern (redneck) accent I slip into every once in a while when I'm feeling silly. :roll: I figured it was appropriate when Uytuun started talking about "the things Americans have done to the language". Rednecks practically have a language of their own. "Y'all" is a more inclusive "you", and I think "grits" are something akin to hash browns. IIRC, "kiss my grits" is used as an expression of surprise.

Just listen to a Jeff Foxworthy comedy album, and you'll see what I mean. :lol:

And yet, despite all this, my 3rd grade English teacher didn't know if we were learning British or American English. :cry:

Some things I've noticed: the use of present perfect: British say ' I've lost my keys' while Americans say 'I lost my keys'; or 'have you got a car?' and 'do you have a car?'.
Another: the past participle of the verb get is gotten in American English. Example: He's gotten much better at playing tennis.
British English: He's got much better at playing tennis.
My english classes gave me this experience:

British - American
aerial - antenna
anywhere - anyplace
trousers - pants
timetable - schedule
sweets - candy
wardrove - closet
ill - sick
mad - crazy
interval - intermission
peep - peek
nowhere - noplace
postman - Karl Malone... errrr ... mailman
queue - line

That's so far, I'm sure I'll remember some more.

Actually, in England, the word 'pants' is often used as an expression for something that has gone wrong. For example, "That Ian Bell is complete pants!" to describe an international sportsperson who is not performing to the standard expected. Or "Pants!!" as an alternative to swearing when your PC crashes on you.

Another one is "pear-shaped" to describe a situation that has gone downhill on you. For example, if your team was winning 2-0, and is now losing 3-2, you might moan "Oh man, it's all gone pear-shaped now!" Not sure if that is one that is used or recognised in the USA or not.

It's all gone Pete Tong!

Actually, Barmy probably knows loads of crazy phrases that are well-known in his local region but that even people from the rest of England wouldn't understand. That's one of the crazy things about England that for a small country (in land mass) it has remarkable variety in the way its language is spoken within even that country (let alone how it is used around the rest of the world).

There's probably as much difference between how a Yorkshireman, the Queen, and a Cockney speak, as there between how an American and New Zealander do.

@HB: probably more! :lol:

And that list doesn't even include Geordie, which is a whole other language. :shake:

Did you know that there's no word in the English language (according to OED) that rhymes with oblige ... And that the word "queueing" contains the longest unbroken run of consonants!

Some little tidbits for you there, before bedtime :)

Isn't it true for all language on earth? Isn't normal for a language to be different depending on it's geographic location?

Yeah, but in England it changes dramatically just going from East London to South London.

Actually in the USA there is a great variety. I think TV has brought a little more leveling to our language but I can remember visiting New England less than 20 yrs ago and being unable to understand some of the local people. In my childhood there were people in the Smokeys that still spoke a form of Elizabethen English. Or Northumberland English. A lot of Scots had settled there but it wasn't Gaelic.

Same as in Spain: usually a guy from Barcelona can't catch up with a guy from Sevilla; there are others like Vascos, Galicians and Valencianos.
It happens the same in Argentina, around the world, an Argentinian is known by he's accent but what people don't know is that they are just from Buenos Aires, and they are the only people who talk like that, the rest of the country has another very different accent (and they use lots of different words), but is the people who don't usually leave the country (for living or touring).

Galicians are practically Irish people. Galicia is just like Ireland, but with much better weather and food.

There is also that unofficial US language where the words 'sooooo', 'like' and 'totally' are used and strange ways, and 'mixed and matched' such as "Totally dude" meaning 'yes' or "Like noooooooo!" meaing 'no'. No matter where I have travelled in the US, there are always groups of teenagers that speak that way, dispite the local dialects.

With Ireland, the further up North you travel, the more Scottish we sound, and faster we speak. As I was brought up on a Gaeltacht (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaeltacht) region, my pronounciation of English is strange, as is my accent.

the past participle of the verb get is gotten in American English. Example: He's gotten much better at playing tennis.
British English: He's got much better at playing tennis. Actually, "got" is the correct form, even in the Americas. "Gotten" is slang.

Actually, it's just a different tense. "He got" is correct, as is "He has (He's) gotten".

Does England have its own version of Ebonics?

BrE: get got got
AmE: get got gotten

Only the past participle changes depending on the variant of English. Gotten isn't slang, it's proper AmE pa.p. Though IIRC got is also allowed, but practically never used in the US.

"Gotten" also appears in Walter Scott's books. Not in narration, though, it's just the Scottish folks who use it.

I suppose Cockney is something like Ebonics.

It's actually very easy to mimic an Australian accent; just move your top lip as little as possible when you speak.

Instant Aussie!

Hrm...

There is no such thing as British English or International English.

It's simply English.

There are regional dialects based on English. For example : American English, Australian English, Scots, etc.

Being Scottish it causes no end of irritation to me when England, United Kingdom, and Great Britain are interchanged.

England - A member country of The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
Britain - A shortened version of Great Britain.
Great Britain - The island, consisting of Scotland, Wales, England.
The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland - Consists of the countries of Scotland, Wales, England and the province of Northern Ireland.

Football is known the world over as Football. You can also call it Association Football.

There is, however, an arguement that says Football is the name for whatever sport is meant by it.

Soccer is an unacceptable word in my book. Americans can't just go renaming other countries sports because they clash. Likewise us Brits can't just go renaming American football to Gridiron.

I have to admit I'm guilty of that. I use Great Britain and United Kingdom interchangably. I guess I'm screwing over the Northern Irelanders.

Hey, Britain is no shortcut for Great Britain! It's just the name of the whole island. :p

It's actually very easy to mimic an Australian accent; just move your top lip as little as possible when you speak.

Instant Aussie! :lol:
I am trying...

Soccer is an unacceptable word in my book. Americans can't just go renaming other countries sports because they clash. Likewise us Brits can't just go renaming American football to Gridiron. Fantastic argument!

Also, some phonetic shortcuts can help in speaking Aussie.

For example, when saying "Melbourne," think "Melbin"...

Wow, such passion for what a sport is called. Football played with a round ball (trying to avoid offending :lol: ;) ) is really not that popular in America. It has some regional and ethnic popularity, but Americans in general don't enjoy watching or participating in it, and are not going to try to differentiate between 2 sports with the same name. That said there are some areas where soccer (sorry, but it is just easier) is very popular, and there is some attempt to call it by a more traditional name, "futball", phonetically pronounced as it is spelled, but it is pretty spotty.

Personally, I am not offended if some people want to call American Football "Gridiron". It wouldn't matter to me if a majority of Americans, or the owners of the NFL, started calling it gridiron and its generic name changed to that. I am sorry if it offends, but getting worked up over what a sport is called seems a little, well either obsessive or petty. Isn't life too short to get worked up over something like that? :confused:

Yeah, Darkwolf. For some reason the 'football' people are the only ones getting all upset about the word 'soccer'. The 'soccer' people don't really care if other people call it 'football'.

Football is becoming more and more popular in the US and I think they will win the World Cup within the next 12 years.

I don't think anyone gets upset or offended by the word 'soccer', it's just very annoying. Imagine somone poking you in the back of the head, you turn around and tell them it's annoying and they shouldn't do it, but they carry on regardless. it's kind of like that.

Why do Euros get upset when Yanks call Football "Soccer", while Yanks wouldn't be bothered if Euros called American Football "Gridiron"? Simple: Yanks tend to think of Football/Soccer as more of a women's sport, and that apparently annoys Euros to no end. Euros could perhaps yank the Yanks' chains a bit by setting up "Women's Gridiron" as an olympic sport, but just calling American Football "Gridiron" won't cut it.

That being said, Soccer isn't the only women's sport (http://www.princeton.edu/~puwrfc/gameShots/index.htm) the US has imported from GB... ;)

Bion, now you're just deliberately stirring things.

Let's get back on topic. In New Zealand, we call that thing that holds water a 'bucket' but in other places, you might call it a 'pail'.

Hmm, can't find a button to quote a post. Never mind! :)

Anyway, the island is called Great Britain.

And again, back to 'soccer'. It's not the name soccer that's offensive, it's the attempt to rename the game by nations that have only recently taken up the sport.

The USA is such an important country these days that it's not possible to ignore their media, or their spin on things. With the USA calling it Soccer, and Europe calling it Football, nations outside of Europe and North America are then faced with a choice over what to call it. All of a sudden 'soccer' seems acceptable because that's what the USA calls it.

My real name is Dave. Everybody I know calls me Dave, David or Davie. If suddenly 50 new people started working with me, going to the same places as me at night, etc etc, and they all called me Mike... then I'm going to start getting called Mike. Wouldn't please me!

Football doesn't belong to America to rename, that's what I think the problem is.

Say that to Roy Keane, Bion :lol: .
Football is the best sport on this Earth, the US are finally being less self-obsessed and taking more interest in it and playing it more, rather than just sticking to their own pathetic excuses for sports :) .

Biddaboom.

Yeah, I guess I was kinda taking the piss. But the women's rugby is kinda intense, no? And, actually, right before I wrote that post, I saw a mother walking with her daughter, who couldn't have been more than 3 years old, and who was completely kitted out for soccer, including tiny little cleats, shinguards, etc...

Back to the topic: What about when editors try to selectively shift content in books from, say, an American to a British context. Like the first Harry Potter being called "Sorcerer's Stone" in the US (because, apparently, us Merkins is too stupid to get "Philosopher's Stone").

I recently read this so-so cyberpunk novel called "Market Forces" by a Brit named Richard Morgan, which had some of the most ham-handed attempts to "Americanize" a book I've seen in a while. One of the most glaring was having a major character sitting in his office playing with a "baseball bat", in a novel set in some future dytopic London no less. Not only was he described practicing a bunch different swings, including one as though he were thrown a "curveball", but at one point he was even polishing his bat! Now, first of all, Brits don't play baseball, so you have to wonder what he's doing with the bat. Second, you don't have nearly the variety of swings in baseball that you do in cricket, so while someone might practice their "swing" they wouldn't practice their swings. Third, you don't have a special swing just for curveballs, it's more a matter of adjusting your swing (I'm guessing in the original the "curveball" was a "googly"). Fourth, no one sits around polishing their baseball bat; if there was a similar kind of kit-fetish in baseball, it would be with baseball gloves, which are lovingly oiled for suppleness and flexibility and occasionally tied tightly with a baseball in the webbing to make a decent pocket....

Nice points, Bion. I always find it a bit insulting to Americans when people 'Americanise' things like that as if they're going to be too dumb to understand. That Harry Potter one was a classic. What on earth was the point of changing the name of the book (and movie) like that? No kid knows what a philosopher's stone is anyway, no matter what country they live in.

No kid knows what a philosopher's stone is anyway, no matter what country they live in.I did when I was a kid. :p

And "Sorcerer's Stone" is intrinsically stupid.

Anyway, the island is called Great Britain.Alas, no. Great Britain is the product the union of 1707 between England and Scotland. The island's name has been Britain since Roman times.

No kid knows what a philosopher's stone is anyway, no matter what country they live in. I did when I was a kid. :p

And "Sorcerer's Stone" is intrinsically stupid. Ditto. And I be as Americanisationed as ya can git, y'all. :lol:

Not to be an ugly American, but I must point out a few things...

When I was just a young LNT, I played soccer/football and their were females on the team. When I got older, my high school had an all female soccer/football team and so does the college I attend now.

There are no female football/gridiron teams, or if there are, they are an obscure curiosity. In fact, most high schools have a day where the cheerleaders play football and the football players cheer. It is meant to be comical but actually comes off more as homo-erotic...but hey, maybe that is just me.

American football requires quite a bit more physical strength than soccer, but even more importantly, at least in a comparative sense, it requires the player to be significantly more violent.

Physical strength and violence are masculine qualities. Hence football is manlier than soccer.

That is not to say that soccer is not a great sport and loads of fun, I just would not fear for my life if I stepped onto a professional soccer field.

Hope I'm not being too pedantic here...

Google : Define Great Britain (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=define%3AGreat+Britain&btnG=Google+Search)

Hmm... Great Britain is mostly a political term, but it looks like it isn't such a modern invention. You won't really hear Great Britain as a geographical term outside the UK, I think. Anyway, thanks for that one. ;)

@LNT: A coed football team? :eek: It's common knowledge that girls can kick boys' ass in football if they try, so they may as well play in one team, but I just hope there was no politics, quotas and locker room problems surrounding that idea. :p

About girls and boys in football.

I'm guessing here. But is the case in America that the boys play American football, and the girls play Association Football. And the boys that aren't any good at American Football play Association Football?

Other than that I can't place why girls would be better than boys.

At the moment though, FIFA runs separate mens and womens football teams. I think that's because women currently can't compete with men, but in the future I'd like to see that dropped, and just have teams.

As for manly/feminine. Over here we play Rugby Football (Union rules). It's basically American Football without padding, helmets, and breaks every 4 seconds for a cheeseburger. And yes that's me winding you up now :)

Nah, just saying girls could play as well as guys. It's a male sport for cultural reasons, I guess, or maybe it appeals to men more strongly than to women. In violent versions of the game, guys will obviously have an edge but in civilised running after the ball, European style? But perhaps there is something I don't know.

Hmmmm. I know there's a topic buried in here and I know it's not football, because then the thread would be in Whatnots. The topic is the English language -- let's stick to that, shall we?

Hmm... Great Britain is mostly a political term, but it looks like it isn't such a modern invention. You won't really hear Great Britain as a geographical term outside the UK, I think. Anyway, thanks for that one. I think the name derives from Britain. Great Britain is the part behind Britain, that's a tad bigger. Therefore Bretagne and Grande-Bretagne. Britain than logicially would end up being Britanny. Because naming it Britanny would allow people to chose freely between Great-Britain and Britan and use, interwinde and interchange those terms as if they were synonyms.

So basically, we Americans do not speak English anymore, we speak American. I'll even go as far as to say that nobody speaks English. The Americans speak American, and the British speak British.

On another, interesting, note: Modern English isn't actually the english we speak today, it is what Shakespeare spoke. So that puts us in post-modern english, correct?

That "Sorcerer's Stone" thing was such a crock. The Philosopher's Stone is described in the book, for crying out loud! They should have just cut to the meat of it and just called it "Harry Potter And The Potion Of Life" if they were going to dumb it down that far.

Also, some phonetic shortcuts can help in speaking Aussie.

For example, when saying "Melbourne," think "Melbin"... Just about every North American I've met has mispronounced it as "Mel-born". They should have learned from the British that place names don't follow normal pronunciation rules.

Cases in point: Gloucester, Worcester (and as for the sauce, heh, good luck saying that correctly without help!)

But the core of that point is right; generally, make something as easy to pronounce as possible and you're halfway to sounding Australian.

So how do you say Melbourne? I always pronounce it like you described, although I do know the correct way to pronounce the other places you mentioned (the last syllable there is similar in pronounciation to "shire", right?).

US - Merrywidow
English - Basque

Mis-pronounced UK cities - Armagh & Glasgow

ar-ma
glaz-go

Tourist pronounciation

ar-mag-ah
glas-goui

[ November 08, 2005, 16:02: Message edited by: Cúchulainn ]

:confused: OK, I have no idea what either a merrywidow or a basque is. I'm not ever sure how one would pronounce "basque", although I'm guessing it would would be like bask.

They very similar to corsets. And your pronounciation of basque would be correct :D

Corsets? Now I'm really confused. In English, a corset is a garment, popularized in the 18th and 19th centuries worn by women between their breasts and waist. It had draw strings on it, and by pulling them really tight, it would make the woman look very thin. However, since those haven't been popular for over 100 years, I can't imagine that's what you're referring to as a corset.

http://www.figleaves.com/us/nsf/qwiser.asp?term=corset&original=corset&match=exact

You are behind the times my friend. Do yourself a favour and buy your wife some of these ;)

Edit: I think its just certain brands that refer to Basques as 'Merrywidows', and not necessarily a US term.

That stuff is corsets only in name for the greatest part. :p

And you can't really define pure British or American anymore. BBC and CNN are everywhere, not to mention books, movies and games. Foreigners who learn English are especially screwed. :p I suppose my own sounds like a mix between British and American sometimes because I often can't even tell when it's text and there are no obvious particularities like or/our, er/re, have just done/just did etc.

In fairness, chev, most British folks are now using more of a mixture of UK/US English without even realising it's happening. When cross-pollination between the TV schedules is so commonplace it's difficult to filter out the turns of phrase that come from more "traditional" sources from those that originate across the pond. Particularly tricky in English, because we have so many different expressions and phrases that are - taken literally - meaningless, but we learn them from the context their used in in everyday speech. That's the part of the English language I'd find most bewildering if I was an EFL student, because it's so difficult to translate that sort of thing. I'd hate to think what it would have been like if there existed such a thing as Bavarian rhyming slang, and it turned up in a German listening test! :eek:

EDIT: I just realised that "across the pond" is just one of those meaningless-at-face-value phrases I was talking about... :shake: Which I think proves my point... maybe. *cough*

EDIT2: so is "at face value". Crap. :doh:

so is "at face value". Crap.How about prima facie? :shake:

I think one of the tricky things is when words abandoned in British English (there's no such thing really, but hey...) return to English. Where the original language of settlers from England has been preserved to a large extent, it should actually be more conservative than what's spoken in Britain, for even more confusion, shouldn't it? :D Besides, I admit I was jaw-dropped when I saw "gotten" or "color" in 19th century British books. :shake:

When I was younger, my biggest problem was phrasal verbs and articles. Prepositions probably too, but I only realised that when I had learnt enough to notice. :shake: Sometimes I still make quite embarrassing mistakes when it's late and I'm tired. Or ommit difficult spots on purpose. ;)

I hate it when people start every sentence with the unnecessary word "Basically, . . . . . "

So how do you say Melbourne? I always pronounce it like you described, although I do know the correct way to pronounce the other places you mentioned (the last syllable there is similar in pronounciation to "shire", right?). It's usually "mell-bun". Of course, that's really because we're all lazy as hell and the extra consonant (r) is too much hassle, so it gets dropped. Either that, or it's a grand conspiratorial tourist-identifier method... I'm undecided on that.

@ chev - I can only imagine how annoying it must get (although I must say, yours is considerably better than the vast majority of people I know who use it as a first language). English has enough words already without trying to assimilate every dialect-specific word/meaning as well. I'm sure that there are similar problems in plenty of other languages - my limited German repertoire would probably be useless/laughable when conversing with a Bavarian (no offence meant to any Bavarians on SP!). Perhaps resurrecting Latin is a better option...

@ Magpie - Bavarian rhyming slang? :hahaerr:

British English (there's no such thing really, but hey...) Strangely enough there is it's a sort of upper middle-class posh english that is still spoken in what used to be colonies of the British Empire, mainly by people who act as if the empire still existed. I've met some of these people and it is wierd the english that they speak and therby think in.

The only other time I have heard this type of english was in Russia when it was still the USSR and Andropov was premier, I had gone there to deliver a paper and was provided with a translator who spoke this same sort of perfect British english. It was only when I returned to England and was asked to identify my transaltor that I found out the bloke was KGB and learned english from Philby etc and thus a sort of perfect english with a Cambridge university overtone

It's usually "mell-bun". Of course, that's really because we're all lazy as hell and the extra consonant (r) is too much hassle, so it gets dropped. Either that, or it's a grand conspiratorial tourist-identifier method... I'm undecided on that.Or "r" before consonants was already mute in English when you broke off from Mother England. ;)

Perhaps resurrecting Latin is a better option...It was so littered already in the early dark ages that they had to import monks from the isolated Hibernia/Ireland to recover some reasonably uncontaminated Latin. But Latin is so fun for SMSes and e-mail. :shake:

To refer back a few pages:

Brit: oleo; Amer: margarine (chemist: toxic waste)

Oleomargarine, as it was then called, first came into wide use during WWII, due to the scarcity of butter, which was rationed both here and in Great Britain. It was packaged, at least in this country, in a white one pound block, along with a little packet of yellow powder that you could pound into it to make it look like butter.

It was after the war during the Bevan-Acheson negotiations of 1947, following some bitter wrangling by the Minister and the Secretary, that it was finally agreed that Britain would have "oleo" and the U.S. could have "margarine". This groundbreaking decision was the only fruitful outcome of the discussions, which soon afterwards deadlocked hopelessly over the word "mayonnaise".

[ November 10, 2005, 04:38: Message edited by: Cernak ]

I know this is from two months ago, but such injustices cannot stand...


Also, in NZ, we clean the floor with a 'vaccuum cleaner', not a 'hoover'.

And when we sell all our household junk, it is at a 'garage sale', not a 'yard sale' or a 'car-boot sale'. Maybe this is just the particular region of the US I live in, but I've never personally vacuumed with a 'hoover'. I may have vacuumed with a Hoover brand vacuum cleaner at one point, but it's always referred to as a vacuum cleaner. Also, my mom enjoys going to 'garage sales' on saturday mornings, though use of the term 'yard sale' isn't completely unheard of.

Heh, I went to "Hoover Junior High School" right across the street from the Hoover corporate headquarters (in Ohio), and never heard "hoover" used as a verb (except by Brits)....

One good tell as to the spread of AmEnglish will be teenagers saying "like" twelve times in every sentence: "So she was like "I think he likes you" and I was like "no way" and she was like "yeah way" and I was like "omg"...

Some people talk like that here, also Bion, but it sounds worse with Belfast accents, as 'like' become 'leik'.

Armchair linguists...

Looking back over this thread, and expanding on what HB sorta said (I think), here we do use a mixture between english and american english, with some of our own words thrown in there just to liven things up.

Traditionally, New Zealand spoke english english. Infact, two centuries ago when the colonists first came here, the government, worried about the children picking up different accents and words from the Maori, sent for a load of English teachers from London to teach the children 'proper' english, in order that they don't loose their accent. That obviously didn't work :)

More and more resently - espcially amoung the younger people, and those who spend far too much time infront of TV/computers - people have been using more and more American terms. Hearing Deathmage talking about Cookies always annoys me. It's biscuits!

Words like Football here always causes a bit of confusion. Gridion is more often used to describe American Football, but then Soccer is commonly used as well. I guess to most people football refers to Soccer - once again, our british origins.

Mixed in with that confusion of languages we also have a few Maori words dotted here and there. Can't think of any off the top of my head (probably because I'm so use to using them that they seem normal), but I'm sure with a bit of thinking it would be easy to come up with a long list of words that, other than HB and other kiwis, none of you would understand ;)

One thing that I've noticed a lot the last few years, when on the internet, is the use of the word full stop vs period. Here that little dot that goes at the end of the sentence is called a full stop, but when I say full stop when speaking with a forgien audience, no one has a clue what I'm speaking about. Don't know if that's a kiwi thing, or a more widely used word.

Just a quick glance over the lists of words so far in this thread, we generally use:
Petrol.
Soccer.
Sausages.
BBQ.
Boot.
Bonnet.
Rubber.
Chips (instead of fries)
Both Cellphone and Mobile, although more and more resently cellphone seems to be taking over.
Clothing is another that is drifting more and more American, although I still use the English versions.
Herb.
biscuit.
Nappy.
Footpath.
Pram.
Aluminium.
Chips (refering to crisps as well).
Margarine.
Rubbish bin.
Ladder.

Hearing Deathmage talking about Cookies always annoys me. It's biscuits! Yes!!

Mixed in with that confusion of languages we also have a few Maori words dotted here and there. Can't think of any off the top of my head (probably because I'm so use to using them that they seem normal)Like whanau, iwi, mana, kai etc?

Yup :) There we go! Thanks.

How about:
hospital pass
kicking for touch
game of two halves
swanndri
it's all about whanau

English is my second language, I probably have words "carried over" from American english. Like cookie. I watched Sesame Street as a kid...

In America, its cookie. Too bad for everyone else. I ask you not to get angry at the way we speak: it is a dialect, just as Argentinian Spanish (or Mexican, or whatever) is different from Spain Spanish, even though they are the same language. I wouldn't worry about it if I were you.

And they're cookies :)

But it leads to weird misunderstandings, like the horrible sounding (to us) dish "Biscuits and Gravy".

Well, it is horrible.

Dialects aren't so bad as mixing dialects or creating impenetrable jargons. The latter aren't actually so bad if people use them in their own company, even if it sounds weird. But I don't like when someone pulls ghetto talk on me. I'll try my best if it seems to be the only way the person can communicate but if it's just a fancy manner of speech, my patience is short. Peculiarities are okay, but I'm not going to put up with confusing fads. No rhyming slangs or anything.

I'd hardly call cockney rhyming slang a "fad". Mixing up the language for comic effect is fairly common place and it often has a fairly easy set of rules to follow. Betty Swalls for example.