I cannot find the tables for assassins' backstab. I wanted to get to x7 before dualling to a mage.

What level would anyone recommend?

You'll find it here, with some more info: http://www.sorcerers.net/Games/BG2/thieves.htm

When you want 7x damage you'll have to wait for lvl-21 :D which is a little late to really enjoy all the advantages of your dualling combo in SoA ;)

I would recommend to wait till lvl-15, then your poison weapon will be fully developed and you'll have the chance to develop a few or your thieving abilities to a useful degree:
On lvl-15 you'd have 240 ability points, allowing you safe perfection (120 points per skill) in two skills or an average ability in 3 skills (80 points per skill). If I were you I'd probably choose to develop hide in shadows and move silent to 120 points.

Considering the disadvantages of the dc assassin-mage the dc swashbuckler-mage could be much more interesting for you: When you want to dual as a lvl-15 swashbuckler, you'll have a -3 AC bonus, a +3 THAC0/ damage bonus, ** for your fav melee weapon and weapon style (maybe staffs), 390 ability points to use on your abilities - allowing you to develop 4 abilities to a useful degree, 3 to perfection (possibly stealth and detect illusions ... or detect illusions, find traps and open locks - given you like to do the twisted rune early ;) )
Sure, you'd have no backstabbing then ... but you'll have a very robust and flexible mage ... and a much better thief too ;)

[This message has been edited by Ragusa (edited February 22, 2002).]

Or just a plain old Thief/Mage dualed at level 13! Plenty 'o skills and you still get a x5 backstab!

Just a hint, unless you have the expansion installed AND are soloing, I don't recommend dualing that late. It's just not worth it, especially since you won't have your abilities through most of the game.

Also, from a powergaming view point, the Assassin/Mage isn't a very powerful character, unless you wait for a x7 backstab...I just made mine because I liked the name, and it FIT him. He was an Assassin/Mage and played like it...

I dual classed at level 13, and only put 50/50 in stealth, and ended with about 95 in picklocking and disarm traps, and a x5 backstab, that's it. The one main thing I found most powerful about him was the poision weapons ability, which even worked against Liches and Golems with Tasheron's Bow...

Don't bother too much with stealth, because there are countless invisiblity spells that work just as well, and once you get the 6th level "Mislead" that's all you'll need.

And again, unless you're soloing this class is pretty pointless as the strategy of running up to an enemy and backstabbing them and casting spells doesn't really work work with a party.

In the end, he'll be x3 as much of a Mage as he is an Assassin, like any dual classed character, so keep that in mind.

LS,
I disagree with you about the number of skill points useful to invest in thieving abilities. For mainly one reason:
As you pointed out rightly any dc mage-thief will primatily be a mage. These ability boosting items occupy equipment slots you might like to use for other, maybe more useful, items. Some examples:
<UL TYPE=SQUARE>
<LI>rings - when you use the thievery ability boosting rings you cannot use the magespell-boosting rings, and unequipping the latter would result in you possibly loosing unsused spells. It also occupies slots where you could place rings of protection.
<LI>boots - sure, the boots of stealth will improve your stealth, but when you rely on them to achieve a sufficient stealth skill you cannot use other, maybe more useful footgear - boots of speed/ of the north/ of grounding/ avoidance come to my mind.
<LI>armor - you cannot use the stealth-bonus armors and cast spells at the same time. When you don't spend a sufficient number of ability points in your thief skills the armor penalties, for elven chain especially, could render your skill useless.
[/list]
Finally this is a philosophy conflict. Personally I don't really like to use invisibility potions a lot (not only becuse it becomes boring abfter a short time). I think the wide availability of these potions is a little unballancing. I also don't think it's wise to use a dc mage for backstabbing, even when you do the mislead trick, however, that's again a question of preferences.

Um, Ragusa, where did I say to equip items that increase thieving scores? :hmm:

That's the very reason the Assassin/Mage is such a weak character, IMO. He doesn't have practically any theiving skills. I really don't see the point in totally forgoing Lock Picking and Trap Disarming, skills you will NEED in a solo game, or if you want to be the only thief in your party, just to max out on stealth. The second level spell invisibility can do the same thing, and 50/50 worked usually on the first try.

that's funny, I never needed Trap Disarming in my game, lol, nor lock picking. :)

*Knock* *Knock* lvl 2 spell for the mage part

Gloves of pick pocketing and Ring of Lock pickings are easy to swap out with Bracers or a ring of protection when they are needed.

Sure, just like the boots, gloves and rings can be exchanged quickly. However, I dislike the aproach of completely "pumping-up" a character - what kind of hero is someone who's totally dependent on his equipment?
Additionally the item-rotation results in plenty of micromanagement - and probably extended pausing ...

An unknown hero in an unknown dungeon:
"Ok, first I'll take my ring of sixt sense and the boots of stealth, for I fear traps could be in my way and I want to scout undetected ...". So he sais when he moves on ... <hero moves through dungeon carefully ... suddenly an ogre magus jumps in his way> PAUSE <the hero sits down, exchanges the ring of sixth sense with the ring of protection +2, and takes off his boots of stealth, digs out the boots of speed from his bag of holding and takes them on> UNPAUSE ... the hero obviously has lightning reflexes and while he suddenly moves with incredible speed, the ogre grunts: "Die, human MUAHUAHUA ..." and gets ready to cast a couple of deadly magic missile on the hero - "OUCH! That hurt!" the hero cries when they impact <the player remembers two arrows of slaying he has found some time ago ...> PAUSE <player searches the arrows in his bag of holding and loads them on his bow> UNPAUSE ... the hero fires his deadly arrow that only scratches the arm of the ogre ... but the ogre drops dead immediately.

"That was easy" the player sais, I'll play on insane the next time ... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: period

[This message has been edited by Ragusa (edited February 23, 2002).]

ROTFL!:grin::grin::grin::grin::grin:

I couln't stop myself to say it!

I'll go with Lord Sarevok here. Invisibility is so easy to get, esp for a T/M that points are much better spent on anything but stealth or move silently.

Edited:
I prefer not to use Knock when I can get xp for picking them as a thief.

[This message has been edited by Earl Grey (edited February 23, 2002).]

Yes, and also that is level 2, which I like to devote entirley to Invisbility.