Experience with D&D before playing BG2

*Saber* · Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 9:34pm

Okay, so to move away from the troll thread and to something that interests me - how much experience did you have with D&D before playing BG2?

Personally, I had no experience whatsoever, and was somewhat confused, but still thoroughly enjoyed BG2 enough to stick around and play it again. Now I also play other RPGs based on D&D and even play the paper-and-pen version occasionally.

*Splunge* · Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 9:44pm

I had played IWD a couple of times, but it seemed that BG2 was more involved rule-wise. In fact, I originally visited SP because I was looking for BG2 info. Of course, the fact that this site is populated mainly by a bunch of morons means that I got no help whatsoever...

...oops! I think a recently-banned member is channeling through me!

pplr · Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 9:45pm

I'm a long time 2nd edition person and was prior to BG1. Played a bit of the old D&D games, involving Phlan & Dragonlance (cannot remember what they were called off the top of my head).

For me I think games may be a good way to learn a newer edition of pen and paper D&D if I decide to.

I remember how BG1 wasn't as specific with the weapon proficiencies as pen and paper.

*Montresor* · Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 9:55pm

My only experience was PS: T.

I also knew a lot of guys who played Paper D&D back in my uni days but it never caught my interest for some reason.

Blades of Vanatar · Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 9:57pm

Pnp wise, I started out with D&D as a young teenager, which was AD&D for dummies back then. Then we jumped right into 1st Edition AD&D and immediately moved to 2nd edition. Good times! When 3rd edition came out, I bought the books immediately and was thoroughly surprised with the total transofrmation, but loved it. The 1st AD&D PC games were pretty easy to learn, since I knew the game already, the Dragonlance Gold Box games being my 1st. I tried War of the Lance, but didn't like the game play/engine, but Champions of Krynn immediately got my attention. As did the Phlan series, jumping into the the Savage Frontier duo.

Knowing the system before hand helps alot, but not all PC RPGs are based off of a already in place PnP game. It doesn't take much to get the basics of most of these PC games, that guy was being ridiculous and/or just plain lazy. I learned the Wizardry 8 format rather quickly without ever playing that system prior. I think that one is a tougher sell than the IE format.

Caradhras · Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 10:01pm

You should have made a poll with BG and not BG2, many have probably been playing BG 1 in 1998. The way you made the poll you can't discriminate between those who played BG1 and other much older games like Pool of Radiance.

I was 9 when I was offered the basic D&D ruleset. It's been a while.

Lynx Lupo · Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 10:59pm

None.
It was not such a good argument anyway as the games use only a mangled subset of the rules (agonising the reverse engineers and purists).

Rahkir · Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 11:08pm

I played BG 1 first, but before that I had no prior D&D experience. I never played PnP when I was younger, but I stared playing a weekly PnP game a few years back, and we've just began using 4e. It's actually quite fun.

dmc · Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 11:32pm

I started playing D&D in 1981 or so. Played consistently through about 1985. Played the gold box games (all of them), Eye of the Beholder, etc., along with games that were not completely D&D based (like Wizardry and Ultima, etc.) so I had a great familiarity with all rules before BG came along.

Ironhawk Skylord · Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 12:34am

Played BG1 first and went to BG2.

Since I had not played any D&D based CRPG's nor PnP before, I was up to my hair in troubles, and had a lot of reading and catching up to do, as you can imagine.

When I met Tarnesh at FAI I got my behind handed to me many times.

I was so proud when I finished BG1 and thought I was a real hotshot.

That changed when I met my first lich in Crooked Crane Inn...

NOG (No Other Gods) · Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 1:57am

Before BG2, I had played BG1, Warriors of the Eternal Sun (Genesis AD&D game), and Eye of the Beholder (didn't even play that much).

In early middle school, a friend tried to DM a game of D&D for a bunch of us, but none of us (DM included) had any idea what we were doing. This was proven by my playing a "beholder" (first time I had heard the term) wielding a "Vorbal blade" (again, first time I had heard that term). Looking back, I have no idea how a beholder wielded a blade of any kind, much less a vorpal blade (don't drop it)!

Déise · Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 2:11am

I played the Mega Drive game Warriors of the Eternal Sun but I really don't know if that should count. It was incredibly light on the rules and hid them all behind the scenes. I also played (well, read the books and magazines more than played) a lot of Warhammer and stuff so I did at least understand what a D8 meant and was comfortable with judging dice roll type stuff.

I do understand the guy's point though. Baldur's Gate is very explicit in following the ruleset slavishly and in making it explicit rather than behind the scenes. The weapon proficiencies are split into far too many categories for example, especially as you're useless with a weapon unless proficient in it. A lot of the spells in the game are useless. Likewise a spell telling you it will affect D6+2 HD of monsters is spectacularly unhelpful. What are HD of monsters? It doesn't say. I now know that it's roughly equivalent to a monster's level but there's no way of telling what a monster's HD is, ever. Unless you read some of the D&D rulebooks.

I blundered through of course and now a lot of the stuff is second nature to me. But BG could have added a heck of a lot of user friendliness without compromising its entertainment, merely its slavish devotion to the rule book. It lags way behind user friendliness than nearly all other RPGs I've played, especially Japanese ones.

Scythesong Immortal · Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 5:49am

Zero, BG2 was my first D&D-based game. Although I've read a lot D&D stuff like rulebooks and monster manuals since then, I read them mostly out of curiosity and for the "storybook" value.
Although BG2 was the most "immersive" game I played at the time, it wasn't the most complicated. The DOS puzzle games of old could probably traumatize new players nowadays.

a soubriquet · Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 6:05am

I had only played Icewind Dale 1 with Heart of Winter (ToftLM was not out yet) and Baldur's Gate with Tales of the Sword Coast prior to Baldur's Gate 2. I found this site, actually, looking for a walkthrough or work-around for a bug I encountered early in the first D&D game I had played - IWD.

I never understood tx's point, actually. I never bothered to try to understand the rules before playing, especially since I had played other games using somewhat randomized mathematics to determine hits or misses before any D&D games. Really, a lot of games are similar when it comes to such things - they are just a lot less explicit about it. I just figured out what an HD was as I played and used the spells, noticing what was affected and what wasn't affected. I just guessed and played around with things until I understood everything sufficiently, without a strong need to beat it the first time ever playing.

I have been very interested in playing PnP, but my sociophobia restricts me quite a bit when it comes to interacting with people, in person especially, as well as not knowing anyone else in the area that played PnP that I might be comfortable enough with to play with strangers as well. Maybe the wife and I can go exploring the area sometime...

*Loreseeker* · Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 9:31am

None here too.

Although I did play PS:T at the same time as BG2. Took me a while to figure out how spellbooks worked. (Memorizing spells and all).

Fred the archer · Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 10:35am

My experience with RPG started with a pen and paper game in the mid 80´s. Moved on to computer games like Bards Tale, Dungeon Master, Bloodwych.

Then had 10 year break from RPG’s, before a friend lent me BG2. Now I’m hooked.

Morthond · Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 12:05pm

I started BG1 when I was 12 without any prior knowledge at all. Sure I didn't really understand some stuff but it didn't really effect my enjoyment of the game at all, and I learnt it over time. If I'd started with BG2, it might have been a different story, starting at 89,000xp with lots of spells, the various kits to choose from, more specific weapon proficiencies etc. I can see how it would be overwhelming.

*Montresor* · Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 1:20pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morthond

If I'd started with BG2, it might have been a different story, starting at 89,000xp with lots of spells, the various kits to choose from, more specific weapon proficiencies etc. I can see how it would be overwhelming.

More or less my experience. I had only played PS: T before but still thought I'd get into BG2 quickly. Then I got my hindquarters handed to me a couple of times in Irenicus' Dungeon, in the Circus, and in the sewers under the Copper Coronet, and I realized I still had a thing or two to learn.

*T2Bruno* · Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 4:55pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmc

I started playing D&D in 1981 or so. Played consistently through about 1985. Played the gold box games (all of them), Eye of the Beholder, etc., along with games that were not completely D&D based (like Wizardry and Ultima, etc.) so I had a great familiarity with all rules before BG came along.

Ditto for me, too. For me it was table top 1980 - 1985. I even played in a convention in Seattle in ~1987. Ultima rocks (I even played Ascension).

*8people* · Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 6:02pm

Played BG1, then BG2, then was harassed into a 2ed D&D game which never actually started.

Only started playing D&D after joining #Sorcerers in which it was 3.5ed and at least two years after first playing BG.

I managed to fathom out what everything was all by myself. I found the dice notation simple and easy enough to fathom, but then again I was a maths kind of girl back then

henkie · Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 9:40pm

Did not even know D&D existed before stumbling across this place in search for a walkthrough for BG2. The AC and THAC0 thing was a bit confusing at first - normally higher is better, but here lower was better - but looking at the differences between various armors it wasn't hard to figure out how BG rated the AC thing. The rest wasn't that hard. I did then and still do now rely mostly on melee combat and consequently my first character was a fighter: you hit stuff and it dies. Not overly complicated as such.

My first try at a magic user was a solo sorcerer. I don't like to micro manage everything, so in a party, mages were generally only throwing rocks or sharpened objects at people, so in order to reduce the micro management, I did away with the party. And did away with the memorising of spells through a spellbook, which I find rather bothersome. Spell selection I mostly did by the guidance of some of the posts here and some guides. The rest I learned through playing for myself and trying things out.

The whole HD thing is still rather opaque to me, though. They should've either not mentioned it at all, or have made it so that you could somehow glean in-game what a monster's HD is.

As an aside, it is interesting how many people in this thread have been members of SP for a long time but have really low post counts. I guess this thread is somehow very successful at drawing out the lurkers among us

Blades of Vanatar · Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 9:52pm

There was no need to show in game the HD of the various creatures. You only need to know this for a few spells as it is. By showing how badly wounded a creature was from physical damage, ex... Badly Wounded, you could gauge the HD from there. If you dealt 50 damge to a creature and it's status was showing as Injured, it was pretty easy to approximate you were halfway there. It would be obvious that your spell that only affects 4 HD creatures wouldn't work on that creature. Though I can say that I never looked in a creature file to see if they were consistent with the PnP game when assigning various HD to the creatures. I would think they stayed close to the PnP game.

henkie · Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 11:50pm

I agree that there is no need to display HD of creatures anywhere in the game to show their strength. You'll find that out the hard way anyway. My gripe with it is that it is used in the spell description, but it not used anywhere else in the game, nor is it self-explanatory. I think it was at least half a year before I even learned that HD stood for Hit Dice. Which doesn't explain anything either, but whatever.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Déise

It lags way behind user friendliness than nearly all other RPGs I've played, especially Japanese ones.

Interesting that you chose jRPGs as an example of intuitiveness. I've only ever played a bit of Final Fantasy 8 (I think, it was the one after the curiously popular one), but intuitive was not what I would use to describe the gameplay mechanics. There have been few games where I've been even anywhere near as confused as to what the chuffing hell I was doing than in doing combat in that game. Even though it is one of the most popular jRPG series there is.

Déise · Wed, 4th Nov '09, 1:34am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blades of Vanatar

There was no need to show in game the HD of the various creatures. You only need to know this for a few spells as it is. By showing how badly wounded a creature was from physical damage, ex... Badly Wounded, you could gauge the HD from there. If you dealt 50 damge to a creature and it's status was showing as Injured, it was pretty easy to approximate you were halfway there. It would be obvious that your spell that only affects 4 HD creatures wouldn't work on that creature. Though I can say that I never looked in a creature file to see if they were consistent with the PnP game when assigning various HD to the creatures. I would think they stayed close to the PnP game.

Do HD dependent spells function in the same way as HP dependent spells? I thought (though obviously not an expert) that HD was a starting stat as such. I know a dragon will fall to Power word: Kill if it's injured enough, can it fall to Death spell or can that never affect it?

Even if it can, there's still no way of judging starting HD.

Scythesong Immortal · Wed, 4th Nov '09, 4:32am

It also took me a while to understand what HD was, but I never took it against the game. Not knowing everything about it was what had kept me hooked in the first place. Considering the stuff that has come to pass because BG2 wasn't as simple or direct as a game like Diablo 2, then that kind of "user unfriendliness" is not a bad thing.

I don't think trying to "standardize" everything is healthy if what you really want is "new" stuff, "unique" stuff, "special" stuff, "challenging" stuff. Nope, there should be limits on that.

View Poll Results: What experience did you have with D&D before BG2?
No prior experience	17	32.69%
Only played games like BG2	16	30.77%
Only played table-top (paper-and-pen) D&D	3	5.77%
Played both D&D-based games and table-top D&D	13	25.00%
Other (explain)	3	5.77%
Voters: 52. You may not vote on this poll

Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 9:34pm	#1
Saber SPS Account Holder A revolution without dancing is a revolution not worth having! Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Boston, Massachusetts Age: 19 Posts: 4,238 Rep Power: 11	Experience with D&D before playing BG2 Okay, so to move away from the troll thread and to something that interests me - how much experience did you have with D&D before playing BG2? Personally, I had no experience whatsoever, and was somewhat confused, but still thoroughly enjoyed BG2 enough to stick around and play it again. Now I also play other RPGs based on D&D and even play the paper-and-pen version occasionally.

Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 9:44pm	#2
Splunge SPS Account Holder Bhaal’s financial advisor Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: In hiding after Bhaal became Lord of Murder when I had him put everything into subprime mortgages. Age: 49 Posts: 5,147 Rep Power: 23	I had played IWD a couple of times, but it seemed that BG2 was more involved rule-wise. In fact, I originally visited SP because I was looking for BG2 info. Of course, the fact that this site is populated mainly by a bunch of morons means that I got no help whatsoever... ...oops! I think a recently-banned member is channeling through me!
	__________________ I was trying to daydream, but my mind kept wandering. - Steven Wright

Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 9:55pm	#4
Montresor SPS Account Holder Online Walkthrough Writer Mostly Harmless 30k Starfighter Champion! Breakout Champion! Cutie Quake Champion! Driller Champion! Tournaments Won: 2 Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Denmark Posts: 2,103 Blog Entries: 1 Rep Power: 10	My only experience was PS: T. I also knew a lot of guys who played Paper D&D back in my uni days but it never caught my interest for some reason.
	__________________ No single raindrop believes it is to blame for the flood.

Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 9:57pm	#5
Blades of Vanatar Vanatar will rise again Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Rockford, Illinois Age: 36 Posts: 1,253 Rep Power: 10	Pnp wise, I started out with D&D as a young teenager, which was AD&D for dummies back then. Then we jumped right into 1st Edition AD&D and immediately moved to 2nd edition. Good times! When 3rd edition came out, I bought the books immediately and was thoroughly surprised with the total transofrmation, but loved it. The 1st AD&D PC games were pretty easy to learn, since I knew the game already, the Dragonlance Gold Box games being my 1st. I tried War of the Lance, but didn't like the game play/engine, but Champions of Krynn immediately got my attention. As did the Phlan series, jumping into the the Savage Frontier duo. Knowing the system before hand helps alot, but not all PC RPGs are based off of a already in place PnP game. It doesn't take much to get the basics of most of these PC games, that guy was being ridiculous and/or just plain lazy. I learned the Wizardry 8 format rather quickly without ever playing that system prior. I think that one is a tougher sell than the IE format.
	__________________ Bad decisions make good stories.

Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 9:45pm	#3
pplr Gems: 10/31 Latest gem: Zircon Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 386 Rep Power: 3	I'm a long time 2nd edition person and was prior to BG1. Played a bit of the old D&D games, involving Phlan & Dragonlance (cannot remember what they were called off the top of my head). For me I think games may be a good way to learn a newer edition of pen and paper D&D if I decide to. I remember how BG1 wasn't as specific with the weapon proficiencies as pen and paper.

Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 10:01pm	#6
Caradhras I may be bad... but I feel gooood! Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Lugdunum Age: 31 Posts: 2,380 Blog Entries: 5 Rep Power: 10	You should have made a poll with BG and not BG2, many have probably been playing BG 1 in 1998. The way you made the poll you can't discriminate between those who played BG1 and other much older games like Pool of Radiance. I was 9 when I was offered the basic D&D ruleset. It's been a while.
	__________________ I feel like I've passed an arbitrary experience point limit and gained more power.

Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 10:59pm	#7
Lynx Lupo Gems: 5/31 Latest gem: Andar Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Slovenia Age: 25 Posts: 108 Rep Power: 0	None. It was not such a good argument anyway as the games use only a mangled subset of the rules (agonising the reverse engineers and purists).

Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 11:08pm	#8
Rahkir Gems: 2/31 Latest gem: Fire Agate Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Appleton, WI Posts: 34 Rep Power: 0	I played BG 1 first, but before that I had no prior D&D experience. I never played PnP when I was younger, but I stared playing a weekly PnP game a few years back, and we've just began using 4e. It's actually quite fun.

Mon, 2nd Nov '09, 11:32pm	#9
dmc SPS Account Holder Distinguished Member Moderator Speak softly and carry a big briefcase 3 Card Poker Champion! Asteroids Champion! Balloon Shoot Champion! Bumper Golf Champion! Falldown Champion! Hexxagon Champion! Plumber 2 Champion! Rotations Champion! Towerball Champion! Tournaments Won: 2 Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Los Angeles, California, USA Posts: 4,175 Rep Power: 17	I started playing D&D in 1981 or so. Played consistently through about 1985. Played the gold box games (all of them), Eye of the Beholder, etc., along with games that were not completely D&D based (like Wizardry and Ultima, etc.) so I had a great familiarity with all rules before BG came along.

Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 12:34am	#10
Ironhawk Skylord If a tree kills alone in the forest, does it make a sound? 12 Many Champion! Abadia Champion! Air Fox Champion! Dinky Smash Champion! Fishing The Sea Champion! Holy Cow! Champion! Mahjong Champion! Raiden X Champion! Where is The Ball Champion! Squiz Extreme Champion! Join Date: May 2006 Location: Mazed by the Lady of Pain Age: 43 Posts: 510 Rep Power: 4	Played BG1 first and went to BG2. Since I had not played any D&D based CRPG's nor PnP before, I was up to my hair in troubles, and had a lot of reading and catching up to do, as you can imagine. When I met Tarnesh at FAI I got my behind handed to me many times. I was so proud when I finished BG1 and thought I was a real hotshot. That changed when I met my first lich in Crooked Crane Inn...

Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 1:57am	#11
NOG (No Other Gods) Gems: 29/31 Latest gem: Glittering Beljuril Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Virginia Beach Age: 25 Posts: 3,138 Rep Power: 16	Before BG2, I had played BG1, Warriors of the Eternal Sun (Genesis AD&D game), and Eye of the Beholder (didn't even play that much). In early middle school, a friend tried to DM a game of D&D for a bunch of us, but none of us (DM included) had any idea what we were doing. This was proven by my playing a "beholder" (first time I had heard the term) wielding a "Vorbal blade" (again, first time I had heard that term). Looking back, I have no idea how a beholder wielded a blade of any kind, much less a vorpal blade (don't drop it)!
	__________________ "He is a fool who would trade happiness for freedom, or freedom for peace."

Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 2:11am	#12
Déise Gems: 8/31 Latest gem: Skydrop Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Dublin, Ireland Age: 26 Posts: 268 Rep Power: 4	I played the Mega Drive game Warriors of the Eternal Sun but I really don't know if that should count. It was incredibly light on the rules and hid them all behind the scenes. I also played (well, read the books and magazines more than played) a lot of Warhammer and stuff so I did at least understand what a D8 meant and was comfortable with judging dice roll type stuff. I do understand the guy's point though. Baldur's Gate is very explicit in following the ruleset slavishly and in making it explicit rather than behind the scenes. The weapon proficiencies are split into far too many categories for example, especially as you're useless with a weapon unless proficient in it. A lot of the spells in the game are useless. Likewise a spell telling you it will affect D6+2 HD of monsters is spectacularly unhelpful. What are HD of monsters? It doesn't say. I now know that it's roughly equivalent to a monster's level but there's no way of telling what a monster's HD is, ever. Unless you read some of the D&D rulebooks. I blundered through of course and now a lot of the stuff is second nature to me. But BG could have added a heck of a lot of user friendliness without compromising its entertainment, merely its slavish devotion to the rule book. It lags way behind user friendliness than nearly all other RPGs I've played, especially Japanese ones.

Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 5:49am	#13
Scythesong Immortal Gems: 16/31 Latest gem: Shandon Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Philippines, currently in the US Age: 23 Posts: 878 Rep Power: 7	Zero, BG2 was my first D&D-based game. Although I've read a lot D&D stuff like rulebooks and monster manuals since then, I read them mostly out of curiosity and for the "storybook" value. Although BG2 was the most "immersive" game I played at the time, it wasn't the most complicated. The DOS puzzle games of old could probably traumatize new players nowadays.

Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 6:05am	#14
a soubriquet Gems: 5/31 Latest gem: Andar Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Wisconsin, USA Age: 23 Posts: 125 Rep Power: 7	I had only played Icewind Dale 1 with Heart of Winter (ToftLM was not out yet) and Baldur's Gate with Tales of the Sword Coast prior to Baldur's Gate 2. I found this site, actually, looking for a walkthrough or work-around for a bug I encountered early in the first D&D game I had played - IWD. I never understood tx's point, actually. I never bothered to try to understand the rules before playing, especially since I had played other games using somewhat randomized mathematics to determine hits or misses before any D&D games. Really, a lot of games are similar when it comes to such things - they are just a lot less explicit about it. I just figured out what an HD was as I played and used the spells, noticing what was affected and what wasn't affected. I just guessed and played around with things until I understood everything sufficiently, without a strong need to beat it the first time ever playing. I have been very interested in playing PnP, but my sociophobia restricts me quite a bit when it comes to interacting with people, in person especially, as well as not knowing anyone else in the area that played PnP that I might be comfortable enough with to play with strangers as well. Maybe the wife and I can go exploring the area sometime...

Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 9:31am	#15
Loreseeker SPS Account Holder A believer in knowledge Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: In the shadow of a Walnut tree Age: 23 Posts: 1,302 Rep Power: 4	None here too. Although I did play PS:T at the same time as BG2. Took me a while to figure out how spellbooks worked. (Memorizing spells and all).
	__________________ Need a problem solver? Think hammer. Doesn't work? Think bigger hammer.

Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 10:35am	#16
Fred the archer Gems: 1/31 Latest gem: Turquoise Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Sweden Age: 35 Posts: 11 Rep Power: 0	My experience with RPG started with a pen and paper game in the mid 80´s. Moved on to computer games like Bards Tale, Dungeon Master, Bloodwych. Then had 10 year break from RPG’s, before a friend lent me BG2. Now I’m hooked.

Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 12:05pm	#17
Morthond Gems: 3/31 Latest gem: Lynx Eye Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: London UK Age: 20 Posts: 68 Rep Power: 4	I started BG1 when I was 12 without any prior knowledge at all. Sure I didn't really understand some stuff but it didn't really effect my enjoyment of the game at all, and I learnt it over time. If I'd started with BG2, it might have been a different story, starting at 89,000xp with lots of spells, the various kits to choose from, more specific weapon proficiencies etc. I can see how it would be overwhelming.

Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 6:02pm	#20
8people SPS Account Holder 8 is just another way of looking at infinite Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Chirofen Age: 21 Posts: 5,537 Blog Entries: 149 Rep Power: 16	Played BG1, then BG2, then was harassed into a 2ed D&D game which never actually started. Only started playing D&D after joining #Sorcerers in which it was 3.5ed and at least two years after first playing BG. I managed to fathom out what everything was all by myself. I found the dice notation simple and easy enough to fathom, but then again I was a maths kind of girl back then

Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 9:40pm	#21
henkie Gems: 11/31 Latest gem: Bloodstone Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 438 Rep Power: 4	Did not even know D&D existed before stumbling across this place in search for a walkthrough for BG2. The AC and THAC0 thing was a bit confusing at first - normally higher is better, but here lower was better - but looking at the differences between various armors it wasn't hard to figure out how BG rated the AC thing. The rest wasn't that hard. I did then and still do now rely mostly on melee combat and consequently my first character was a fighter: you hit stuff and it dies. Not overly complicated as such. My first try at a magic user was a solo sorcerer. I don't like to micro manage everything, so in a party, mages were generally only throwing rocks or sharpened objects at people, so in order to reduce the micro management, I did away with the party. And did away with the memorising of spells through a spellbook, which I find rather bothersome. Spell selection I mostly did by the guidance of some of the posts here and some guides. The rest I learned through playing for myself and trying things out. The whole HD thing is still rather opaque to me, though. They should've either not mentioned it at all, or have made it so that you could somehow glean in-game what a monster's HD is. As an aside, it is interesting how many people in this thread have been members of SP for a long time but have really low post counts. I guess this thread is somehow very successful at drawing out the lurkers among us

Tue, 3rd Nov '09, 9:52pm	#22
Blades of Vanatar Vanatar will rise again Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Rockford, Illinois Age: 36 Posts: 1,253 Rep Power: 10	There was no need to show in game the HD of the various creatures. You only need to know this for a few spells as it is. By showing how badly wounded a creature was from physical damage, ex... Badly Wounded, you could gauge the HD from there. If you dealt 50 damge to a creature and it's status was showing as Injured, it was pretty easy to approximate you were halfway there. It would be obvious that your spell that only affects 4 HD creatures wouldn't work on that creature. Though I can say that I never looked in a creature file to see if they were consistent with the PnP game when assigning various HD to the creatures. I would think they stayed close to the PnP game.
	__________________ Bad decisions make good stories.

Wed, 4th Nov '09, 4:32am	#25
Scythesong Immortal Gems: 16/31 Latest gem: Shandon Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Philippines, currently in the US Age: 23 Posts: 878 Rep Power: 7	It also took me a while to understand what HD was, but I never took it against the game. Not knowing everything about it was what had kept me hooked in the first place. Considering the stuff that has come to pass because BG2 wasn't as simple or direct as a game like Diablo 2, then that kind of "user unfriendliness" is not a bad thing. I don't think trying to "standardize" everything is healthy if what you really want is "new" stuff, "unique" stuff, "special" stuff, "challenging" stuff. Nope, there should be limits on that.