Fool's Fate

[Avarahtar]

I finally managed to buy Fool's Fate today and just finished reading it. I'm curious as to what everyone who has read the book thought of it. Was the book a fitting conclusion to the Farseer/Liveship/Tawny Man saga? I'd really just like to hear some opinions about the book and perhaps on all three of the trilogies as well.

I'll give my own opinions after a few people post. At the moment my opinion on Fool's Fate is pretty mixed and I'd like to think on it some more before posting anything about it.

[joacqin]

It is a Farseer book, and thus it is great. My overall impression of the Tawny Man series is that it is one very very good series however, I too have some small peeves Fool's Fate. The ending mostly, I know it is Hobb's work to do with as she please but I found that everything fitted too good in the end, everyone got what they wanted and every little piece on the puzzle fell into the place in the happiest way. This might not have been something to complain about if the ending hadnt felt rushed as well. The last 50 or so pages takes the breath out of your lungs when you read them and Hobb can do that quite often but now it isnt because it is so touching but because so much is happening in so short a time.

[Gehn]

Well the Farseer and Tawny Man books are my all time favourites. I personally thought the end of the Fool's Fate was about as perfect as you could ask for. Yes everything did fit into place, but think of all that the characters(especially Fitz and the Fool)have lost. Fitz has had his life literally torn apart, socially, mentally and physically. He has endured so much hardship throughout the books - No point in me going into it, you've read the books and the same can be said for almost all the main characters. These are hardships, trials and tribulations, we as reader expierience step by step, blow by blow, along with the characters. And there have been so (almost too) many. By having a very happy ending, i didn't feel cheated, i felt compensated. I mean how many times did you say to yourself "For the love of God, when is something going to go right for Fitz?" I felt that the happiness all the surviving characters gained at the end of it all was deserved, not a "fairy tale like" fabrication. And there is no point in throwing in a bit of tragedy at the end of a story just for the sake of it. Just so the reader goes away having felt a few more pangs of emotion. I was happy for Fitz, Molly, her children, Dutiful, even Starling. What they all got was a long awaited dose of Karma. The final line of the book just sums this up i think, "I am content." Isn't this what we have always wanted?

There were some threads that i thought would have been tied up in a, for want of a better word, "official," manner, but you also have to take into account (and i do hate speaking of these books in this way) that these books were written to make money, as well as touch the hearts and minds of the readers, one would hope. So bearing in mind that Robin Hobb thought that the Farseer trilogy was the final Fitz and Fool installment, but then she she wrote the Tawny Man, realising that she could and wanted, to continue. This is why i think she left some threads not completely tied up at the end of "Fool's Fate." As if you look at her FAQ section on her site, she says that she "thinks" this is the end to it all. But should she ever get another surge of inspiration and idea, she would'nt hesitate to write another trilogy. So perhaps she was keeping her options open, and her publishers happy, by leaving some threads not fully knotted.

@ Joacqin - i can definitely see why you would think the end was rushed. But all stories that operate on a very personal, yet epic level, will always seem "rushed" in my humble opinion. As how do you give an end to something that is so immense? You could write pages and pages explaining the hows and whys in acute deatail, but that would patronise the reader a bit i believe. As if they have truly interacted with the story, they will know all these because the book has already told them or they would have deduced such anyway. Take the ending of "Lord of The Rings" for example. Both Book and film formats. They end in a similar way to that of "Fool's Fate." The ending of LOTR the film was more long and drawn out to that of the books. Did you believe this to be better or worse? So a happy ending to stories of this scale, i believe is a reward, and a way of saying thankyou to the reader. Such is the case for "Fool's Fate" also, in my opinion.

[Meatdog]

Well, though I'm glad for Fitz, my favorite series is still the Farseer trilogy, since that one didn't really have the super happy end, but wasn't really a bad ending either. It's that kind of ending that is missing in most of the fantasy books.

But I agree that there is still much to build farther on, but I don't think Fitz will have another series. And it isn't needed, there is enough material to continue with a fourth series. And on that idea I say "BRING IT ON!!!" As you can guess, I can't wait for it to be written.

So overall this is still the best series (all three of them combined) I've ever read, except for Song of Ice and Fire from George RR Martin. So my opinion would be

[joacqin]

The books about Fitz is among the best if not the best I have ever read. That is why I found the end of Fool's Fate slightly disapointing, it doesnt completely fit with the rest of Hobb's work. I too would want a happy ending, as you said, Fitz and company truly deserved one but the one we were handed slid into place a little too smoothly and most of all it went too quickly. I find there is a gulf between Fitz reviving the Fool and Fitz being rescued from the skillpillar, what happens before the rescue and what happens after doesnt really fit. After the "captivity" in the skillpillar it seems like Hobb rushed to meet deadline and just tossed in every happy event she could find. Everyone found a perfect happy life and the absence of that is one thing I liked with Hobb. For me the ending actually got sugarcoated and that isnt something I generally connect with Hobb. All this said I wouldnt be as presumptious as to say that I didnt like the ending or that the ending was bad, it just wasnt as brilliant as Hobb's writing tends to be.

Just for the record I find the end of LotR to be truly awful. The story ends when the ring is destroyed, so should the books. Jackson made a good ending of Tolkien's extremely prolonged one. The cleansing of the Shire could have been a wonderful little novel or shortstory in its own right but not part of LotR.

[Gehn]

Yeah i can see your point. But i suppose there isn't really a right or wrong way Hobb could or should, have ended the book. That's all in the eye of the beholder. I thought the end was fitting. Agree with you about the LOTR thing.

[david w]

How do Robin Hobbs' books compare with, say, George R R Martin's A Song of Ice & Fire?

I keep hearing so many good things about her but then if you look hard enough you'll find good things about every author. Is she *really* that good?

[joacqin]

They are very different but just as good. Hobb and Martin are without question the two best fantasy writers I have ever read and I have read a lot. They arent really possible to compare to each other as Hobb is a very characterdriven first person story where you follow one character all the time and the greatest strength of her writing is in my opinion her ability to instill emotion in the reader. I atleast raged, rejoiced and weeped plenty while reading her books. Mostly weeping.

[david w]

I'm really tempted to give her a try.

[Gehn]

You should be! She is brilliant. Like Joacqin said, her books have very character driven, 1st person narratives. That is the reason why i think her books are so great, because of the extreme level of empathy you get with the character whos eyes you see the book through, as a result of that. In the Fitz and Fool books, Fitz's freinds are you freinds, his enemies your enemies etc. You really do become incredibly emotionally involved with the books. Again, like Joacqin said, you rage, rejoyce, and boy do you weep You experience a huge range of human emotion in fact, and Fitz takes you through it. She is just a genius. A visionary story-teller.

[david w]

Okay I'm convinced. Which series is her first? Or which is recommended reading?

[Avarahtar]

Alright, now that I've thought about the latest book for the past day or two and read a few opinions I think its time for me to actually add something to the thread and there may well be more than a few SPOILERS in it.

I really highly enjoyed reading Fool's Fate. Once I opened the book I didn't close it until I had finished it. But like joacqin, I found the ending did tie everything together almost a bit to neatly and the emotional tone at the end of the book seemed almost too happy to be written by Hobb. I also did find that while the ending of the book took up a lot of pages, too many things happened in it and while not really rushed, I thought it could have been a bit less condensed. This is where I still have mixed opinions about the book. I really enjoyed most of the book up until the last trip through the skill pillar but after that one trip I found it too condensed. I'm sure part of this is because I am really sad that the story is finally over. As often as I may have wished I could reach into the book and slap some sense into Fitz he's still my favourite fictional character.

Did anyone else find the death of Burrich wasn't really as powerful as they thought it would be? I almost cried when Nighteyes died, and when the Fool dies, and even actually at a lot of other points in the books. Yet when Burrich died I really didn't feel anything, yet I always really like him.

One other thing I found with the book is that too many loose ends were tied up in it. One of the things I've always enjoyed about Hobb's books is that at the end you don't know what really happens to everyone. The only things I was really left wondering about at the end was what happens with the Fool and the Black Man. One the topic of why the Fool, I found the whole arguement with how he doesn't want to remain with Fitz because of how Fitz will age will the Fool is still young highly suspect.... Couldn't Fitz use the skill to stop himself from aging like Kettle did?

[Gehn]

David W, your first stop when you next leave your abode should be a bookshop! The first trilogy i think you should read is "The Farseer Trilogy." Wonderful, just wonderful...

POSSIBLE SPOILERS BELOW!!!

Avarahtar - yeah i didn't feel the imapact of Burrich's death as much as i thought i would either. But i don't think that's a bad thing. I mean his death was quite placid in the way it all transpired. His continualy worsenning leg being somewhat of a metaphorical indicator as to his eventual demise, also the skin over his eyes etc. His death was happening slowly but surely for a long time, so when he did finally die, i think we didn't feel the impact to the full due to the fact we knew it was innevitable. So his death was rather like the letting out of a breath that has been subconciously held for a very long time, (if you don't mind me going a bit poetic ) It was the lack of suprise in it that did it for me i think...I *think*.

As far as Fitz using the skill to stop his aging, i 100% agree. Although...i finished them a while back, but doesn't Fitz have a strong aversion to using the skill in such a way? I mean doesn't the body pay dearly for such an affect? The way it is forced to expend resources that it doesn't neccessarily have. Wait...that might just be skill *healing* though. Yeah, and kettle seemed ok for someone who is what, 200 years old! Anyway, maybe that was one of the things Hobb left hanging so she *could* write another trilogy if she so wished.

[david w]

Thanks. I'll try the Farseer trilogy. I've not read the rest of your post as you mentioned spoilers.

[joacqin]

More spoilers!

I too didnt feel very strongly about Burrich's death but that wasnt in any way anything negative for me. Burrich was old, he had many old injures, his eye sight was failing and of course the way in which he died. He died protecting his son by using the magic he despised, went out with one final last boom. There wasnt really much else for him to do in life. I think Burrich too was content.

As Avarahtar said and I mentioned as well so is there a drop after the final trip through the skillpillar. Everything written after that could have been given more care and thought. I honestly think that Hobb really wanted to make her deadline and give everyone a happy ending and thus almost just listed everything that happened instead of letting it evolve gradually as she usually do. Fitz just came out of the skillpillar after having been trapped there for two weeks and everything had pretty much worked out during that time.

One thing I really really would have wanted more off was Fitz/Nettle interaction. Their tale is so heart wrenching that I would really have liked to read more about their getting to know each other, in person and not just in the dreams.

[Gehn]

Yeah me too. I would have loved to of seen their relationship develop a bit deeper.