Saddam Hussein sentenced to death by hanging...

Kitrax · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 12:04pm

I just got the headline off of Google news...which I guess was just posted on the net a little over an hour ago.

Linkage: http://edition.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/me...dujail.saddam/

If my break wasn't up, I'd post my feelings and thoughts on this matter...but the clock is ticking, and I need to get back to work.

Kara Ay · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 12:17pm

While Saddam was a cruel leader,i can think of people who deserve this fate more than him...

Register · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 1:57pm

****. The Death Penalty should never be awarded, so no, I'm not really a fan of this decision.

Dengo · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 1:57pm

He got what he deserved. OTOH USA killed more Iraqi civilians than Saddam but I'm too tired and bored of criticizing USA.

Argohir · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 2:03pm

Saddam is not more valuable than most of the civilians killed in Iraq; however, USA can hang the ex-leader of a country and I don't know why they think they have that right. Hope someone hangs Bush one day. Even the dream of being the executioner of Bush makes me happy

Abomination · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 2:53pm

I'd rather have a dead Saddam than a live one. If anything it'll show leaders that they can't just 'purge' their own populations into submission without some type of personal concequences.

What else would you do with him? Keep him alive and imprisoned forever till he dies anyway? Might as well save everyone's time. I wonder how much the rope they hang him with will be worth on E-Bay?

Trellheim · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 2:58pm

The fact that US has done bad things doesn't somehow erase Saddam's nasty work, he got what he deserved.

Still, hanging might be bit too vulgar.

chevalier · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 3:00pm

The legality of the court is doubtful. It's a result of a most probably illegal invasion by the USA and it's common knowledge how much influence Americans have had on the court. Not sure about judges, but while you couldn't really take Baathist ones for such a job, it's not like an opposition judge won't face a big challenge staying neutral. Then, it's obvious that the date falls before American elections. What's next is that there have been so many claims that the defandants' human rights have been violated that I really begin to wonder what kind of treatment they have received. Would an independent court in a country still having death penalty pass any different sentence on Saddam? I doubt that. Would a different method of dealing with Saddam work out better? I can't really say. But this is going to make him into a martyr and show a couple of things about the American understanding of justice in international relations.

Let me also point out that there's a number of people who get away with war crimes in the American military and somehow that doesn't offend Dubya's or even the public's sense of justice. Why oh why don't people get hanged for murdering civilians, torturing them, gang raping little girls, holding people locked in sheds for further amusement for long months?

Faraaz · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 4:57pm

I don't want to imply for an instant that I think Saddam's just an alright bloke who's getting the short end of the stick...

But bloody hell! How hypocritical are the US?? Really??

They've invaded Iraq, inflicted god knows how many civilian casualties and injuries, not to mention all those incidents which happen in Abu Ghraib and that story I heard about the 14 yr old girl getting gangraped...and yeah....we're the good guys so we'll hang Saddam...cuz we're good right??

Bah!

Rotku · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 6:51pm

To quote Lord of the Rings:

"Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement. For even the very wise cannot see all ends."

We (humans) are in no position to be able to decide who lives and dies. To do so is to play as a god - something we already have enough of in this world, without the need for more.

Register · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 7:24pm

Quote:

I'd rather have a dead Saddam than a live one. If anything it'll show leaders that they can't just 'purge' their own populations into submission without some type of personal concequences.

Instead, they kill him and make him a martyr.

Blackthorne TA · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 7:36pm

Quote:

How hypocritical are the US? ... we're the good guys so we'll hang Saddam...cuz we're good right??

*sigh* So, the US is being hypocritical and hanging Saddam even though it's an Iraqi court's decision? Is it so hard to understand that Iraqi's want the man dead for what he's done to them? I mean many Arabs want people dead for a lot less than what he's done.

Really, some of you need to stop jumping up and yelling "Bad USA!" for every bad thing that happens in the world. I understand you don't like the US, but that doesn't mean every bad thing is directly caused by the US.

EDIT

Quote:

OTOH USA killed more Iraqi civilians than Saddam...

Care to back that up? Or is that just another of those biased "I heard" things? From what I understand Saddam killed more than 180,000 Kurds just in the Anfal campaign, while the IBC estimates 50,000 civilian deaths due to the Iraq war. Not that that's something to be proud of, but to say that the US killed more civilians than Saddam is false from what I can gather.

[ November 05, 2006, 19:57: Message edited by: Blackthorne TA ]

Kara Ay · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 7:50pm

Well "what USA does is always bad" isn't an opinion people support..."Usa usually does bad things" is what people think and ı'm sorry but only an idiot couldn't see Usa's faults and nearly everbody is sure that they somehow controlled the judge's decision...

Blackthorne TA · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 7:56pm

Quote:

...nearly everbody is sure that they somehow controlled the judge's decision...

Oh, of course they are; in Turkey especially I'm sure that's true. That does not however make it accurate.

Kara Ay · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 8:01pm

Well if you read the opinions here,you can see that everybody thinks that...Europe,India....

Blackthorne TA · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 8:17pm

How widespread an opinion is doesn't change how accurate it is. All that shows is how unpopular the US is around the world, and how eager people are to believe the worst.

Kara Ay · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 8:26pm

Well take no offense but at the rate Us is going,it would be naive to believe that they didn't influence the judge...Sorry but Us president isn't known for his fairness....

Dengo · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 8:28pm

Quote:

Or is that just another of those biased "I heard" things?

Some kind of. Here are some numbers. 650,000 may be too much but I don't believe in western journalists' numbers (50,000) too. I will never believe anything those "embedded journalists" say.

Blackthorne TA · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 8:30pm

Quote:

Well take no offense but at the rate Us is going,it would be naive to believe that they didn't influence the judge...Sorry but Us president isn't known for his fairness....

LMAO! Sure, sure, I'll take your word for it without any proof, with the only backing for your belief is others' opinions and that the US president isn't know for fairness.

Quote:

Some kind of. Here are some numbers. 650,000 may be too much but I don't believe in western journalists' numbers (50,000) too. I will never believe anything those "embedded journalists" say.

Do you know where that estimate came from? Johns Hopkins, which is a US university. It has been deriled as wildly inaccurate due to the process the estimate was made from. I find it very amusing that you're taking a US university's estimate as gospel though

Now for the other half of the exercise... How may civlian deaths has Saddam caused? As I indicated 180,000 for one campaign, how many others are there?

nunsbane · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 8:33pm

Who really knows how many Iraqis have died as a result of Dubya's war? The estimates range from tens of thousands to over 600,000 civilian deaths. I suppose the estimate of any particular study depends on the agenda of the author. Considering that we should not be there in the first place even 1 civilian death for which we are responsible is too many.

As for Saddam - waste that evil bastard and be done with it.

Late-Night Thinker · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 8:39pm

@ Kara Ay

Do you think Saddam is innocent?

I don't think the Iraqi court had that difficult of a time determining guilt or innocence. Granted, things did not go smoothly (assassinated lawyers, withdrawn judge, unhinged mass-murderer defendent), but the main function of the court---to determine guilt or innocence---was adequately served.

The hanging is an interesting touch though...

Kara Ay · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 8:53pm

I'm not trying to change your opinion... You say that Us is fair and you are free to believe that...
But most of the world saw what happened..And i'm sorry you can't change their opinion..."actions speak louder than words" i believe that sentence explains the position Us is in...

And i didn't say that Saddam was innocent and had a heart of gold... Saddam is evil and guilty but to make him stand a trial while his country is invaded and then hanging him is cruel too...
I'm sorry but US should realise that not only Justice goes both ways,it can't be manipulated to the way anybody wants... And Us isn't god's hand on earth they should realise that too.. Iraq is our neighbour and everyday we see dead children bodies on tv and newspapers... IF US is so rightful and fair,he/she shouldn't let Israel kill babies and most certainly shouldn't let Us soldiers gang-rape a girl and take a picture while making a boy hold a card that says "sergeant Boudreault killed my dad and ****ed my mom and sister"....

Tassadar · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 9:39pm

Quote:

While Saddam was a cruel leader,i can think of people who deserve this fate more than him...

I nominate Robert Mugabe of Zimbabwe.

Shoshino · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 10:37pm

and thus, the endless war begins

Morgoroth · Sun, 5th Nov '06, 10:47pm

Well considering that I'm against the death penalty I really can't support this judgement. Saddams case should have been dealt with in the international court for human rights. EU has allready condemned this result and I can only echo that call.

As for the trial itself most local experts of international law seem to think that the trial was far from fair to Saddam but on the other hand don't see other possible options which would have satisfied the Iraqi people. I doubt the US had much to do with the sentence even if they had the sentence would have remained the same considering that the trial was largely handeled by those who Saddam had persecuted during his reign.

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 1:57pm	#3
Register Dead Man Walking Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Uppsala/Sweden Posts: 3,147 Blog Entries: 5 Like: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 7,198 Level: 25 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 92.52% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements	****. The Death Penalty should never be awarded, so no, I'm not really a fan of this decision.
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Sun, 5th Nov '06, 6:51pm	#10
Rotku SPS Account Holder I believe I can fly Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: New Zealand Posts: 3,102 Blog Entries: 19 Like: 9 Liked 4 Times in 4 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 7,570 Level: 26 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 48.71% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements Awards	To quote Lord of the Rings: "Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement. For even the very wise cannot see all ends." We (humans) are in no position to be able to decide who lives and dies. To do so is to play as a god - something we already have enough of in this world, without the need for more.
	__________________ I don't believe anything, but I have many suspicions. ~ Robert Anton Wilson

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 8:17pm	#16
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Sun, 5th Nov '06, 12:04pm	#1
Kitrax Pantaloons are supposed to go where!?!? Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Salt Lake City, UT Posts: 7,916 Blog Entries: 11 Like: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 19,724 Level: 39 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 57.7% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements	I just got the headline off of Google news...which I guess was just posted on the net a little over an hour ago. Linkage: http://edition.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/me...dujail.saddam/ If my break wasn't up, I'd post my feelings and thoughts on this matter...but the clock is ticking, and I need to get back to work.

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 12:17pm	#2
Kara Ay Gems: 2/31 Latest gem: Fire Agate Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Istanbul,Turkey Posts: 48 Like: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 336 Level: 6 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 70.38% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements	While Saddam was a cruel leader,i can think of people who deserve this fate more than him...

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 1:57pm	#4
Dengo Gems: 8/31 Latest gem: Skydrop Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Turkey Posts: 272 Like: 1 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 824 Level: 10 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 5.33% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements	He got what he deserved. OTOH USA killed more Iraqi civilians than Saddam but I'm too tired and bored of criticizing USA.

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 2:03pm	#5
Argohir Gems: 10/31 Latest gem: Zircon Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Bilkent Posts: 397 Like: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 1,218 Level: 11 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 94.55% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements	Saddam is not more valuable than most of the civilians killed in Iraq; however, USA can hang the ex-leader of a country and I don't know why they think they have that right. Hope someone hangs Bush one day. Even the dream of being the executioner of Bush makes me happy

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 2:53pm	#6
Abomination Gems: 26/31 Latest gem: Diamond Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Auckland, New Zealand (North of The Shire) Posts: 2,375 Like: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 5,307 Level: 22 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 73.48% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements	I'd rather have a dead Saddam than a live one. If anything it'll show leaders that they can't just 'purge' their own populations into submission without some type of personal concequences. What else would you do with him? Keep him alive and imprisoned forever till he dies anyway? Might as well save everyone's time. I wonder how much the rope they hang him with will be worth on E-Bay?

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 2:58pm	#7
Trellheim The Dreadful Bear Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Finland/Luxembourg Posts: 1,469 Like: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 3,333 Level: 18 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 57.09% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements	The fact that US has done bad things doesn't somehow erase Saddam's nasty work, he got what he deserved. Still, hanging might be bit too vulgar.

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 3:00pm	#8
chevalier SPS Account Holder Senior News Editor Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: I wish I were in the land of coffee... Posts: 16,686 Like: 2 Liked 1 Time in 1 Post vBActivity - Stats XP: 62,754 Level: 62 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 24.51% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements	The legality of the court is doubtful. It's a result of a most probably illegal invasion by the USA and it's common knowledge how much influence Americans have had on the court. Not sure about judges, but while you couldn't really take Baathist ones for such a job, it's not like an opposition judge won't face a big challenge staying neutral. Then, it's obvious that the date falls before American elections. What's next is that there have been so many claims that the defandants' human rights have been violated that I really begin to wonder what kind of treatment they have received. Would an independent court in a country still having death penalty pass any different sentence on Saddam? I doubt that. Would a different method of dealing with Saddam work out better? I can't really say. But this is going to make him into a martyr and show a couple of things about the American understanding of justice in international relations. Let me also point out that there's a number of people who get away with war crimes in the American military and somehow that doesn't offend Dubya's or even the public's sense of justice. Why oh why don't people get hanged for murdering civilians, torturing them, gang raping little girls, holding people locked in sheds for further amusement for long months?

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 4:57pm	#9
Faraaz Gems: 26/31 Latest gem: Diamond Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: St. Gallen, Switzerland Posts: 2,403 Like: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 5,872 Level: 23 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 75.09% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements	I don't want to imply for an instant that I think Saddam's just an alright bloke who's getting the short end of the stick... But bloody hell! How hypocritical are the US?? Really?? They've invaded Iraq, inflicted god knows how many civilian casualties and injuries, not to mention all those incidents which happen in Abu Ghraib and that story I heard about the 14 yr old girl getting gangraped...and yeah....we're the good guys so we'll hang Saddam...cuz we're good right?? Bah!

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 7:50pm	#13
Kara Ay Gems: 2/31 Latest gem: Fire Agate Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Istanbul,Turkey Posts: 48 Like: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 336 Level: 6 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 70.38% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements	Well "what USA does is always bad" isn't an opinion people support..."Usa usually does bad things" is what people think and ı'm sorry but only an idiot couldn't see Usa's faults and nearly everbody is sure that they somehow controlled the judge's decision...

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 8:01pm	#15
Kara Ay Gems: 2/31 Latest gem: Fire Agate Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Istanbul,Turkey Posts: 48 Like: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 336 Level: 6 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 70.38% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements	Well if you read the opinions here,you can see that everybody thinks that...Europe,India....

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 8:26pm	#17
Kara Ay Gems: 2/31 Latest gem: Fire Agate Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Istanbul,Turkey Posts: 48 Like: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 336 Level: 6 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 70.38% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements	Well take no offense but at the rate Us is going,it would be naive to believe that they didn't influence the judge...Sorry but Us president isn't known for his fairness....

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 8:33pm	#20
nunsbane SPS Account Holder Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: indiana Posts: 330 Like: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 1,083 Level: 11 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 33.39% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements	Who really knows how many Iraqis have died as a result of Dubya's war? The estimates range from tens of thousands to over 600,000 civilian deaths. I suppose the estimate of any particular study depends on the agenda of the author. Considering that we should not be there in the first place even 1 civilian death for which we are responsible is too many. As for Saddam - waste that evil bastard and be done with it.

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 8:39pm	#21
Late-Night Thinker Gems: 17/31 Latest gem: Star Diopside Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Lehigh Valley USA Posts: 991 Like: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 2,712 Level: 16 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 98.08% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements	@ Kara Ay Do you think Saddam is innocent? I don't think the Iraqi court had that difficult of a time determining guilt or innocence. Granted, things did not go smoothly (assassinated lawyers, withdrawn judge, unhinged mass-murderer defendent), but the main function of the court---to determine guilt or innocence---was adequately served. The hanging is an interesting touch though...

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 8:53pm	#22
Kara Ay Gems: 2/31 Latest gem: Fire Agate Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Istanbul,Turkey Posts: 48 Like: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 336 Level: 6 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 70.38% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 1.51% Achievements	I'm not trying to change your opinion... You say that Us is fair and you are free to believe that... But most of the world saw what happened..And i'm sorry you can't change their opinion..."actions speak louder than words" i believe that sentence explains the position Us is in... And i didn't say that Saddam was innocent and had a heart of gold... Saddam is evil and guilty but to make him stand a trial while his country is invaded and then hanging him is cruel too... I'm sorry but US should realise that not only Justice goes both ways,it can't be manipulated to the way anybody wants... And Us isn't god's hand on earth they should realise that too.. Iraq is our neighbour and everyday we see dead children bodies on tv and newspapers... IF US is so rightful and fair,he/she shouldn't let Israel kill babies and most certainly shouldn't let Us soldiers gang-rape a girl and take a picture while making a boy hold a card that says "sergeant Boudreault killed my dad and ****ed my mom and sister"....

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 10:37pm	#24
Shoshino Irritant Alien Scum Slaughter Champion! Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: South Wales, UK Posts: 2,000 Like: 5 Liked 13 Times in 12 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 5,528 Level: 23 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 14.07% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 2.46% Monthly Activity 9.46% Achievements	and thus, the endless war begins

Sun, 5th Nov '06, 10:47pm	#25
Morgoroth Just because I happen to have tentacles, it doesn't mean that I'm into Japanese schoolgirls Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Turku,Finland Posts: 2,369 Like: 4 Liked 9 Times in 8 Posts vBActivity - Stats XP: 5,493 Level: 23 vBActivity - Bars Level Completion: 7.94% Daily Activity 2.46% Weekly Activity 9.51% Monthly Activity 25.36% Achievements	Well considering that I'm against the death penalty I really can't support this judgement. Saddams case should have been dealt with in the international court for human rights. EU has allready condemned this result and I can only echo that call. As for the trial itself most local experts of international law seem to think that the trial was far from fair to Saddam but on the other hand don't see other possible options which would have satisfied the Iraqi people. I doubt the US had much to do with the sentence even if they had the sentence would have remained the same considering that the trial was largely handeled by those who Saddam had persecuted during his reign.