October 2001

PoR Review at GamesDomain
Posted Sunday, October 28, 2001 - 2:26 CET by Darien

Here's another disappointing PoR review, this time from GDR, which gives the game only 2 out of 5 stars. The final verdict is rather harsh:

Overall, though, Ruins of Myth Drannor looks like a tremendous mistake. Choosing to be the first computer game to present the Third Edition rules seems to have been the most serious error made by Stormfront Studios. Much of the basic design is confused and unwieldy, likely because the designers were trying to create a game at the very same time as those new rules were being drawn up. In this regard, the game was truly ahead of its time... though that certainly wouldn't be considered a good thing in this instance. One has to wonder who thought this to be an astute idea in the first place. Even at the time that this decision was first announced, I thought that it was more than a little foolish to be basing a game upon rules that had yet to be finalized. The potential for trouble was obvious right from the start.

That initial poor judgment seems to have prevented the game design from ever developing a real identity. Yes, Ruins of Myth Drannor is the first and only Third Edition D&D computer game. But even after playing the game, I'm still not sure what that means. Neither are the designers, as far as I can tell.

Want to read more?

Pool of Radiance Review at IGN
Posted Sunday, October 28, 2001 - 2:19 CET by Darien

IGN offers up this review of The Ruins of Myth Drannor, giving the game an overall score of 6 out of 10. PoR once again receives its highest marks for graphics, with all other aspects awarded less than stellar ratings.

Rather than rolling your character stats, you're given a pool of point to distribute. This makes all the characters seem sort of average as a result. Naturally if you let people roll their own characters, some folks will take advantage of it and keep rolling till they get characters with at least 15 points in all the stats. This point distribution system is apparently a real feature of the 3rd Edition Rules but it still seems cheap to me. Also cheap is the fact that you can't customize the wardrobe colors for your characters.

Feats and skills are automatically assigned and sometimes make no sense whatsoever. Why a caster should need Toughness before Combat Casting is beyond me. And why a caster can only get up to level 16 seems even more strange. That automatically exclude him from using ninth level spells...

While there are some bright spots here and there Pool of Radiance seems uninspired and even a little unsure of itself. I'd be willing to give Stormfront and Ubi Soft the benefit of a doubt since the 3rd Edition Rules were released while the game was in production. Still, the rules had been out for over a year by the time the game was done and I would have expected either a better implementation of the rules or at least a more thoughtful departure from them.

Last Week's Poll Results
Posted Saturday, October 27, 2001 - 19:50 CET by Sorcerer

What we asked:

Q: Do you think that the period of 2D computer RPGs is finally over?
(431 votes total)

If it's a good CRPG, I don't care whether it's 2D or 3D (344) 80%
No, 2D forever! (50) 12%
Yes, 3D all the way! (37) 8%

Seeing the outcome of this poll makes me wonder. Why all this rush into 3D CRPGs when an overwhelming majority of people who play role-playing games doesn't care whether they're 3D or not? We are told by the developers that 3D games allow for much more freedom and customization, and that data for them takes much less space, so you don't need 5 CDs or more to make a decent game. Another fact is that people who spend enough money to buy the latest GeForce card (or whatever) want to be able to use them in any type of game, because otherwise, what is the point of buying one in the first place?

But, as our poll results show, 80% of people who voted aren't particularly concerned with the number of dimensions their games are running in. As long as it is a good game, they're happy with either 2D or 3D.

12% of those who voted are more on the traditional side and are die-hard fans of 2D CRPGs. With the amount of good ones we've seen, it's not really surprising that so many want to hold on to the past.

Only 8% of voters believe that the era of 2D is at an end and that 3D role-playing games are taking over. The first 3D D&D game (Pool of Radiance: RoMD) was not exactly a shining example of what 3D allows a good development team to do, but I am certain that Bioware will do better with Neverwinter Nights. We will just have to wait and see.

Neverwinter Nights Forum Update
Posted Saturday, October 27, 2001 - 0:06 CET by Darien

Trent Oster, Producer:

Alignment System: We are using the 3rd Edition D&D rule for NWN, but we also found the alignment too limiting. In NWN you have a two axis alignment, as in D&D, one axis is between Law and Choas, the other is between Good and Evil. In NWN Alignment is bolsted by a faction system. When you create a module it is possible to make as many factions as you wish. There is one global faction list for NPC characters, reflecting the various faction standings with the other NPCs. Each character has a faction table as well, containing the current standings of that PC with each group. Through factions, you can model much more complex interactions than is possible with just alignments. You don't get off free though. If you act against your alignment it will move. If you act against your alignment too much you will shift alignment.

Derek French, Assistant Producer:

Only a Windows Toolset: Our initial goal was to create a cross platform toolset for the gaming community. However, we have encountered difficulty in obtaining a viable cross platform solution to assist us in porting the Toolset. While we would not like to rule out the possibility of a port to the various operating systems, currently this looks unlikely for the initial release. Sorry, but this is just the way it is right now.

What Affects Conversation? Most conversations in Neverwinter Nights will be affected by the player's intelligence, charisma and wisdom. James Ohlen and the Neverwinter writers have developed a very strong conversation system, where ability scores actually matter.

Bob McCabe, Writing & Design:

Alt-Tabbing Out of the Game: Unless there's some late-developing reason for it *not* to be there, you won't have to worry - because it is in there now.

Don Moar, Lead Programmer, Tools:

On Downloading Modules: If you download a module, you will have full and complete access to it via the NWToolset.

Combat and Non-Combat Skills: The problem with non-combat skills is that someone has to make them have a use in every character interaction in the game (i.e., potentially millions of words of dialog). On the other hand, responding to a bluff attempt is extremely easy for the DM to do dynamically (and probably has bigger pay-off in terms of fun).

So it comes down to the fact that it is time consuming and difficult to script every conversation to respond to numerous non-combat skills. Hence every module developer out there would have to script every single scenario to respond to every single non-combat skill. Not a lot of people would take the time to do it and those players who spent points in these 'role-playing' skills would be hurt. (i.e., 'What do you mean, your module doesn't let me use my bluff skill!').

We choose a small subset of skills/actions that could affect dialog and even that has made our writers write almost twice as much dialog as they normally do to handle a given situation. Combat skills on the other hand are easy. Any player can use them and once the generic combat AI is setup, a module designer never has to worry about them again. Hence, that is why there are more combat skills than non-combat skills in Neverwinter Nights.

No More Installs from Popups
Posted Thursday, October 25, 2001 - 22:50 CET by Darien

One of our regulars was a bit startled this morning when a popup on the News page tried to install a java script for her. Here's what our host at RPGDot had to say about this unwelcome advance:

We have had reports that one of the popunder ads we are running tried to install a java script even if you declined to install it for the first time (there is nothing installed, though, as far as we can tell). We contacted our ad supporter at once and told them what happened. They removed the ad from the rotation until they find out what this was all about.

We are sorry about this incident, and we want to stress that we do have those unintrusive popunders only to ease the pain the server costs cause us - not because we love them :-). We try to make sure that this doesn't happen again - as does our ad supplier.

Neverwinter Nights Forum Update
Posted Thursday, October 25, 2001 - 19:27 CET by Darien

Trent T. Oster, Producer

Level Gaining: We plan on the end user completing our story (60 hours) around level 12-14. The 60 hour play time is probably a little conservative, as you could easily spend a lot more time in our story. We have to re-work the advancement schedules a bit in NWN due to the nature of combat. Pen and Paper advancement is very fast, due to the fact it take an hour or so to play a combat. In NWN the same combat is over in 60 seconds. We are striving for fast advancement at the lower levels, tapering off as you get to be higher level. We aren't out to re-invent the pen and paper advancement sceme, but we do have to "interpret" the desired advancement vs the requirements of our game.

Treasure and XP: Treasure and XP division are huge issues in a multiplayer game. We are planning to deal with XP by sharing it among the party and giving a bonus multiplier for the number of people in the party. ie: soloing a monster you get 100% of 100%. A party of two players, each player gets 50% of 110%. (You would also get more creatures in the encounter, thus higher xp overall). We fought over this point for a long time and the key issue is: Does the cleric deserve fewer XP for healing the party and enhancing the stronger frontline characters than if he/she were fighting alongside. After a long "Discussion" we came to the conclusion there was no fair way to split XP without making the system so complex it became brittle and subject to bugs, so we came up with the sharing system.
As to treasure. The "discussions" on XP were mild compared to the treasure ones. After days of "calm", "Rational", "Discussion" we decided to leave it to the players. If the thief can't be found during the combat and the treasure just doesn't seem very good it might be time to hold the thief upside down and shake him/her for a bit. We are looking into the possibility of "snooping" in someone's inventory for this purpose.

Module Building Tools: The sweet thing about NWN is the rapid turnaround. I can make a module and play it almost immediately. You fire up the toolset, make a few changes, save the file out, launch the game and load it up. Out of all the development tools I've worked with the toolset and game have a very fast revision loop. So, to answer your question, I'd have to say both. Building is really cool, you create a script, fire up the game and nothing happens like you expect. You fire up the tool, fix the obvious stupid thing you did and then launch the game and whammo, it works. Sometimes it even does exactly what you intended. I think a number of people will never touch the tools and NWN will still be great entertainment. I also believe some people will use the game only as a debugging and testing platform, concentrating soley on the tools. Either way it will be fun.

Other Last-Minute Additions? We are quite interested in adding as much functionality to the game as possible. The possible additions with NPC's are very interesting and we have discussed a great number of options. However, we are very tight on development time and we have to concentrate on the core systems to ensure a robust and enjoyable game. An expansion or sequel would be a great place to build on the solid base we are building in NWN.

And the plot is...? We ran about 15 different story concepts in the initial proposal for NWN. The Lizard Queen Plot was one of those initial proposals. The story as it currently stands differs radically from all the early proposals. Have no fear, a few lines of ad copy do not a spoiler make.

Death and Resurrection: The default death option in the official campaign will result in a choice. You can choose to be raised instantly nearby with an XP penalty or you can rely on your group to raise your sorry, dead butt and have no XP penalty. I'd be willing to bet Raise Dead and Resurrection scrolls and items won't be cheap though.
As to permanent death, it is a user setting so, when you go to launch the game, you get to change the settings. If you want, run our campagin with the permanent death setting.

Buying Expansions: Our intent with NWN has been to follow the expansion model. You don't pay a $10 a month fee and trust us to provide content. You have the option of purchasing the new content when it is available. You pay money you get content. I like that. Nice and simple.

The Money: We are still planning Gold as the basic unit. With the million or so data objects we are chucking around we have little desire to add complexity in the money system. I personally like the idea of Platinum down to Copper, but I don't have the heart to even mention adding complexity in this area.

Karl Schreiner, Quality Assurance Lead

Tireless Bioware Staff: Fed Up? Never -- we are specially bred in the Top Secret BioWare QA vats. Genetically altered to have specially padded bums so they never get tired of sitting, and we have this little computer chip in our head that alters perception. So even though I've run through this module 10,000 times now - my brain believes that this is the first time I've ever seen it.
You want to know what the real secret is though... It's the Starbucks downstairs (mmmmMMMMmmmm Triple Red Eye's - It's a Heart attack in a cup), and the mountain of Coke cans piled on my desk. (Donations of cheeto's are of course always appreciated).

Bob McCabe, Writing & Design

Non-Campaign Modules: Well, I believe the plan is still to squeeze some non-campaign modules into a "Goodies" folder on the Neverwinter CD. I'm not sure if any of them will be full-fledged modules, or just stuff like Capture the Flag, Castle Sieges, and games like Chicken Pong. After release, when we all are only working 8 hour days but the caffeine is still keeping us up late, I know we'll all be hard at work on new non-campaign modules in our spare time. I have an implementation plan up and ready to go, and Rob and I have talked about putting together a story idea of his. Believe me, I'm sure most of the office will be wanting to show off what they can do. :)

Composer: I agree with the Danny Elfman fans - that's the only reason I didn't mention him in this thread myself. I have his Music for a Darkened Theatre volumes 1 & 2 and listen to them somewhat often. I think he would do a great job.
As for Patton, the stuff he does solo (the Mike Patton albums) and with his two main projects (Fantomas and Mr. Bungle) is a lot different than the stuff he did with Faith No More. I think he'd make for a great composer.

Alan Miranda, Associate Producer:

NWN Music: Real orchestras are fairly expensive. TA was a full orchestra (the Seattle Symphony) for example, and yes they do sound great. The alternative is to do synth orchestra - now don't think I'm talking about some guy on his Yamaha keyboard here . I'm talking about real musical samples all layered atop of another to create a virtual orchestra. What was used on BG was a synth template of the whole track. Layered on top of this were real instruments which would replace the more prominent synth ones in the track. The end result sound very good, and if the composer's synth library has a lot of samples for each instrument, the music can come out sounding very close enough too a real orchestra. This is more in line with what we're shooting for on NWN.

Intelgamer Reviews PoR
Posted Thursday, October 25, 2001 - 15:56 CET by Darien

This review by Intelgamer takes a look at The Ruins of Myth Drannor from a different perspective. An extremely postive review, it scores the game at 88%.

I know what you are thinking, you are thinking that you have heard a ton of bad press about this game, words such as slow, boring, bugs and pointless. Some of these words are very true statements about the game. Upon release, many people had expectations that this game would be the next Baldur’s Gate, it isn’t. The game is the next Pool of Radiance. The best indicator I have ever heard to describe whether or not you will like this game is, do you like chess? If you find chess to be too slow, or involving way too much thought, steer clear of POR. If you like forming new strategies and don’t mind waiting for your opponent to make his move, or if the anticipation of your next move keeps you excited, then POR is truly going to be a gem of a game for you.

If you can’t tell yet, I love this game with a passion. No game in recent memory has made me want to play it half as much of Pool of Radiance...

PoR Review at GameSpy
Posted Thursday, October 25, 2001 - 15:46 CET by Darien

This detailed review at GameSpy covers all the points of the game, and even manages to find a few "redeeming qualities." Over all, the game receives a final score of 65.

Although I've detailed a lot of bad things about PoR, it has a number of redeeming qualities that make it difficult for me to completely despise it. For one thing, the tactical combat (flawed or not) really grows on you once you get past the early leveling-up process. As you advance you'll get more spells, more skills, and more combat. You'll also find a ton of treasure that will increase your stats and generally make adventuring more enjoyable. In fact, there will be so much treasure that your group will be forced to drop a lot of it. You'll also spend a lot of time exploring and solving simple puzzles that will ultimately lead to getting out of the dungeons to other areas in Myth Drannor. (Admittedly a lot of these areas look the same). There are also a handful of powerful NPCs in the dungeons and cities that will join you in the fight against the evil that has beset the ancient city. Finally, there is close to 100+ hours of gameplay packed into this game, provided that you like turn-based combat. PoR is far from perfect but it's got a lot of good content that is unfairly overshadowed by all the technical issues.

Neverwinter Nights Forum Update
Posted Thursday, October 25, 2001 - 1:29 CET by Darien

Greg Zeschuk, Joint CEO:

Toolset and Release Date: Well guys, I hate to break it to you but we don't have a super secret release date that we only disclose to magazine editors. We have been aiming for the upcoming Winter (year unspecified) and this has not changed. In some cases magazines will make their best estimate on release dates - I can't speculate where PC Gamer got the date March 2002 - you'll have to ask them.

On the issue of the tools, a few people hit the nail on the head by stating they only work with the data intact, and that we want to polish them for public release. While the toolset doesn't have the click and crash interface of our ancient toolsets it isn't currently at the level of usability we need for a public release. We are aiming to have the best game development toolset ever here and we aren't willing to cut corners. We are using the same tools internally (and we're going to open source our modules), but we want the public to use the final version of the tools. They are a work in process that we're focusing on right now.

One final point - While Ray and I are Joint CEOs at BioWare, we also are co-executive producers. We need to be intimately involved in the development of our products so we can lend assistance to Trent, Derek, Alan and the rest of the crew whenever we can. As they guys mention, we are game players and we are playing NWN to make sure it can be the best game possible.

Sometimes it can be frustrating when there is a lack of information flowing, but rest assured if we aren't talking it's because we're working on all of our games.

3D Models and Tiles: Making tiles for NWN is an extremely complicated and technical process - in general we have to do specific coding and we need to be very careful how we build the tiles in order for them to work correctly. I doubt many people except for professional game developers will be able to make tiles (but we do hope for many fans to prove us wrong on this point).

For characters, monsters, and other objects the process is more straightforward (and existing templates can be used as a base). We do all of our work in 3D Studio Max which is quite a costly 3D program - we are going to explore some other alternatives down the road for the fans....

Mods using Toolset: The toolset is really versatile - I've been playing around with it lately and it's extremely impressive just what can be done from a scripting and customization perspective. It does have its limits however - NWN is shipping with standard fantasy-style background tiles and characters and it is far from a trival process to modify these in any way. If you do want to make a Dragonball Z module it will need to use the existing art and rules the game comes with - though take heart, I think we have a number of characters heads with loopy hairdos like those found in the show.

Trent Oster, Producer:

Hit Points: We are implementing two ways of rolling Hit Points. The first is to get exactly what you rolled, no if's and's or but's. The second way is similar, but characters cannot get below 1/2 the max. This mode will be the default and should reduce the chances of characters sucking without the re-load re-roll loop we've all learned to love in CRPG's.

25 Points Point Buy: I agree with CRPG's cutting the player less slack, but 25 points make a pretty solid character. When you get attributes as you advance it makes for pretty impressive high level characters.

Where Will BioWare Play NWN?: After NWN ships I will sleep as much as possible. When not sleeping I will be spending a great deal of time searching out interesting servers and playing. I'm looking forward to checking out a number of the persistent worlds projects and getting involved in a campaign or two. We've got a good amount of work left, but when this game is done it will be well worth the effort.

Rob Bartel, Co-Lead Designer:

WOTC Neverwinter Storybook: Yup. It's a collection of short stories, actually, echoing more of what you'll be doing as mod creators than what we're working on with the official campaign. I did a teeny bit of preliminary editing for the book and got to read through each of them (there's even one about our favorite elven paladin of Tyr in there!).

The good thing about it being a short story collection is that reading through it in advance won't spoil the actual game for you at all.

The Fallen Tower: We've got it in there, alright, and I love all of the secret stuff that they discuss in Volo's Guide. Originally we had intended to delve into that a little bit but we ended up not having the available art time to do the falling phantoms that it's famous for. That said, there are still some dark dealings and strange things going on inside.

There are strange things done, 'neath the midnight sun...

Derek French, Assistant Producer:

Toolset and Release Date: The Toolset has been in use for over a year. And it still isn't finished, and probably won't be until right before ship.

(Ed. note: In regards to the release date anounced by PC Gamer): They made it up. :) They can state any release date they want, however there is still no Official Release Date as per the post in the Official Announcement forum.

Most likely, we will go from "no release date" to "its Gold" and nothing in between.

DMs Can Pause-in-Play: Hehehehe, I always enjoy how not replying to every single thread is considered "dancing" :)

Yes, the DM can pause the game and interact with the world with scripts, NPCs, PCs, examining, spawning, etc. You cannot physically change the environment such as changing tiles or other Toolset specific things. The specifics have not been fully worked out yet, but as DM you will end up with a great deal of control.

After all, you are the DM.

Game Release on DVD: The release format of the game is completely up to our publisher, Black Isle/Interplay.

I cannot comment on whether or not they desire a DVD version of the game at this time. The other issue is that despite the popularity of DVD drives, their install base is still not that broad.

David Chan, Audio Producer:

Up to Date CEOs: Actually, Greg and Ray are very up to date and involved in Neverwinter, they play builds of the game whenever they can. They are hands on CEOs, because they like games and still play on a regular basis. As a matter of fact much of the hallway chatter between Greg, Ray and the rest of us is about the latest games we've been playing. They're not afraid to get in and get their hands dirty, which is one of the reasons I like working here.

Toolset Use: Actually, the Toolset wouldn't be much use for creating modules without the data (tilesets, creatures, sounds, etc) to go with it. Even if it was released today there is a very limited amount that could be done without the data.

Jonathan Epp, Quality Assurance:

QA Testing Software: We do of course use programs for bug-tracking, but it sounds like your more interested in whether we use automated testing tools and the like. We have thought about it and we have also done some research into it. So far we have not been able to find a tool that will satisfy our needs. It's one thing to use these tools for standard Windows apps, but a game is a whole different issue as they often behave in unusual ways compared to a normal app.

Also, let's say we want to test items. The process for testing each item may be very similar, but there are usually variations in how to properly test each one, so doing it 'manually' is often a better way of doing a thorough job. But if you know of a product that you think we may find useful, feel free to mention it and we can take a look at it to see if it would help us or not.

Items Giving Light: I should let you guys know that it is possible to have an item give off light (other than torches). For example, in a little module that the designers had put together there was a quarterstaff that gave off an orange glow. It was a fair bit dimmer than the torch, but it was a lot better than nothing. I'm not sure what kind of variations are possible with this (as in the amount and colour of light), as I haven't had a chance to play with it myself, but things like this are possible. I should also add that I have no idea what will be available in the official campaign.

Bob McCabe, Writing & Design:

Music Composer: I've been voting for Mike Patton all along. Seriously, if I had the money to put a game together and I needed to work on the music, my first call would be for Patton.

Game Needs Alignments: I am not evil. Maybe a little anarchist, but not evil.

This is a response to that old quote about the slavers. There are some good points here (and in the follow-up posts), but there are still too many conditionals. What if the paladin is from another land, what if the peasant is being mistreated. None of that was in the prior example (though it is in the BG2 game).

I'm saying that a slave is being escorted from one site to another. He is properly nourished, but he is still the property of the state. And the local laws are the ones that the paladin calls right. He agreed to them, down to the last letter, before becoming a paladin.

Obviously, we need alignment to some level in Neverwinter Nights because of classes like the paladin. But all I have ever said is that I would feel a lot more comfortable with alignment in the game if we could guarantee that every game would be run by a live DM who could properly adjudicate any affects on alignment. Otherwise, we're left with situations where we have to create more black and white debates - or paladins that free slaves from "evil" townsfolk, because of how they perceive lawful and good, are going to be mighty upset when they lose their paladin status.

More on Alignments: Er - that was actually what I was trying to say, though I substituted "law of the land" for "personal code of ethics." Still, if a paladin's personal code is either completely or partially separate from the "law of the land", then how could that not then be confused with chaotic good? How would you define a chaotic good character? The most common answer I have heard to answer that question is "Robin Hood"... is it in reality someone who goes against their personal beliefs for the good of the land?

Testing 30 Point Points Buy: *plugs his ears* I'm not listening, I'm not listening.

Yes, I am very biased. I like 25-point buy. I don't want to hear the arguments FOR anything else, unless it's for a number less than 25 I am trying to stay very close-minded on this topic. Maybe I'll change my vote to 3d6, no re-rolls, and no stat placing... hmm...

1d2? Hmm... that's a decent idea... I think I'll go suggest it to the team.

Seriously, it isn't that I dislike having a character with a particularly potent stat - I dislike the notion that, in order to have a decent character, you need to have three stats around 16-18. With a high allowance of points, players are going to continue to think that their characters are not good enough unless they have those numbers. Either that, or you'll get something just as ugly: a character who is good at everything (straight 12s, for example).

In honesty, I know this gripe is a result of the skewed way that I view the rule set. I tend to see commoners and such as having stats around 6-10 (using the 3rd edition bonuses and penalties), and adventurers having stats around 8-12; adventurers are the exceptional ones - the heroes - that are capable of making a difference. Still, even adventurers (or commoners) wouldn't have all of their stats at that average level. One or two of their stats would breach the ranks. Rare specimens might see one or two stats truly exceed those values; but most people, especially those rare specimens, would generally see a few of their stats drop below that normal range. I guess I like characters like this because it encourages partying up - just like the different classes, imbalanced characters need other imbalanced characters to become balanced.

Before playing through Icewind Dale, I was told that I would need to make 4 fighters and make sure that they all had 18 scores in strength and constitution. So, to see if it was true, I made a party with only one fighter, and none of the party had a prereq. higher than 14 - but I did make characters whose skills complemented each other; I was well into Chapter 3 before I got too busy to continue playing, and I don't remember having to reload many battles.

I've argued against point-buy before because it somewhat eliminates any weaknesses in a character (by starting characters out with all 8s), but overall, I do like it; it forces you to really strategize over where to place that slim allotment of points, and you still end up with a situation where you need to find other exceptional characters to balance the areas where you are not exceptional.

I just want to see the numbers kept low - 25 points.

(Fan Quote: "Like drippts and elminister? How many points do they have?")
Don't get me started! I think Drizzt could have been a fine character without the uber stats. Same with Wulfgar, Elminster, and all of the rest of them. It does disappoint me to some degree that the DMG states that 32 points is recommended for heroes of the Forgotten Realms, but then doesn't really stay true to that.

(Fan Quote: "Bob, Heh, heh. Of course, I was just joking about 1d2. No need to do anything rash.")
Tee hee I know you were just kidding, so don't worry - I won't do anything rash Like I said, I like my heroes to be heroic. I just have a different scale for what heroic means, and a different view of how heroic, across the board, a heroic character should be. Straight 1d2s might be possible, but it probably would not be very fun.

(Fan Quote: "I agree that 25 is plenty. People who want more seem to forget that a 12 in 2E is not as good as a 12 in 3E; and that in 2E your stats didn't increase every few levels. 25 is more than enough for a 1st level adventurer.")
I agree, too. As Dayln said on page one, you don't need such high stats in 3rd edition. In 2nd edition, high stats are, to some degree, more important, because you often are not gaining bonuses for stats unless they are fairly high. In addition, I believe for most classes you needed at least a 16 in your prereqs. That doesn't even exist in 3rd edition, which seems to suggest that they want people playing with lower stats, but they don't seem to follow through in later manuals.

I think one of our {BioWare} problems, though, is that Baldur's Gate was played by so many people, and in that game you were role-playing the child of a god; you had high stats, but they were more justified. In Neverwinter Nights, you're playing a normal-but-heroic character. Those high stats are no longer justified, but people are used to seeing such powerful machines, and will expect to see it in Neverwinter Nights.

(Fan Quote: "Still, I consider the difference between 25 and 32 point buy to be largely cosmetic. Whatever ends up in NwN, to me it doesn't seem worthy of all this debate.")
But - but - ... then what will we talk about? 25 Versus the World has been a topic of discussion for like - a year now! If you just end it - where would I go? What would I do? First you destroy my logic, then you take away my habit; you are evil!

(Fan Quote: "Personally, we are in favor of a 72 point allocation with no minimums and no sliding scale.")
Sometimes the simple answer is the best one, I guess. Why add all of the complications into the mix? Of course, we're still left with a debatable number.

As for this debate, I think the only solution, and one I have used ever since I witnessed it in use on a MUD, is to keep stats behind the scenes. Players should be given a basic list of stats and told which are better than others, comparitive only to themselves.

i.e. "You have the most confidence in your wisdom, though your strength is exceptional as well; of course, you've never been known as anything other than a klutz. Your other abilities are not exceptional from the norm."

- or -

"While you have long been known as the most brilliant mind in the city you grew up in, you have rarely been known to even reach the levels of the normal man in any other area - excepting charisma, which often makes you a target of adoring men and women alike."

In this way, you can still have stats, and you can still feel good about your character. Of course, you might have the equivalent of a 20-point buy character, while another character could be closer to 35 points; when it's behind the scenes, you don't really know, or care.

On a side note, I also tried doing this with magic items. I would describe how a weapon, for example, looked or felt in combat, and leave the rest to combat rolls that the player never saw. I had one character find a +3 battleaxe that he left behind because he liked a +1 long sword better. He tried using both, but always seemed to roll higher (for "to hit" and "damage" rolls) when he used the +1 long sword, and so he felt that the weapon was just *better* all around (Or maybe I just described the swings of the long sword with more excitement). And never knowing it as a +1 weapon versus a +3 weapon, he created his own image of the weapon, named it, and so forth.

But I'm getting way off topic here; I'll think I'll stop here.

Still, if everyone is equally heroic... if the world is filled with Conan's and Drizzt's and Raistlin's... how does anyone feel "special"? The fact is, all of these players are normal adventurers, but just like professional athletes are likely physically more capable than the rest of us, adventurers are likely more capable at adventuring than commoners. In addition, I didn't say a 12 was the height of a greatness, either But I do think a 16 is pretty extraordinary.

(Fan Quote: "There is a difference between everyone and every player character. In D&D, adventurers are supposed to be rare... not the norm. Not that it matters.")
Right. Adventurers are supposed to be rare, and every (player) character should be above the norm. The point I was feably making is that you cannot have two tiers of adventurers - the elite super heroes and the not-quite-perfect- but-they-manage-to-overcome-the-odds heroes, at the same time because most people won't want to play the lower tier. And if everyone is playing the upper tier, then all you are really comparing yourself to is the non-adventurers. And if you are already better than them, why do you need to be night-and-day better than them?

I like Loghan's point here, though: noble heroes step up from the ranks of everyman to make their mark - exceptional enough to both stand up and succeed - but still having roots in everyman. Good point

I agree on the thing with tiers... I'm playing a bard in a pen and paper game. Not only a bard, but a halfling bard with a -2 on strength who refuses to use missile weapons, a bard with tons of skill points that, every level, get funneled into knowledge skills that will never help our party in combat, and a bard who is selfish about the way that she chooses her spells, choosing spells such as Identify over Magic Missile. And who knows, maybe one day she'll be the one to save the party when the big grunts can't get it done. In a pen and paper game, that's fun. It's understood that you're there to act out a role and enjoy motivations and so forth. In a CRPG, you're dealing with a ladder. You ascend the ladder, you never falter, and when you get to the top, you hop down and climb another ladder. How many people lost their paladin status in BG1 and reloaded? How many people had a character get permanently killed and reloaded? How many people reloaded because they accidentally chose the conversation path that didn't get them the 30,000 XP bonus? How many people reloaded because they answered a question in character, but were eliminated from undergoing a quest as a result?

CRPGs are just different. But then again, that's why I am excited about NWN. It isn't pen and paper, but it's a lot closer, and hopefully, I'll find some people out there who are more interested in playing stories, and not just climbing ladders.

(Fan Quote: "How many people reloaded because of rediculously hard traps or ambushes where it's practically impossible to survive without knowing what will come?")
Haha! Touche Uxs. But that's part of the balancing required on a game that allows you to reload over-and-over again.

PoR Impressions at RPGVault
Posted Tuesday, October 23, 2001 - 4:12 CET by Darien

Over at RPGVault, Jonric has posted his first impressions of The Ruins of Myth Drannor. The initial review is less than favorable, praising (of course) the graphics, but with less positive comments about the interface.

After trying various settings, I ended up either using the longest possible turn setting or turning the timer off entirely due in no small measure to the design of the interface, which requires multiple actions to do just about anything. The primary exceptions are movement, which requires only clicking on your intended destination, and attacking with your equipped weapon, which takes only a click on the intended target. On the other hand, an almost-basic action like casting a Magic Missile spell involves right-clicking to bring up a character menu, selecting the Arcane Spells entry, opening the Level 1 sub-menu, picking Magic Missile, then finally clicking on the target. In addition, the interface elements are small, and mis-clicking means starting all over again; this happened to me a few times, especially when the turn lengths were short. There is a shortcut key (A) to the Arcane Spells, and it's also possible to map commonly used spells and combat actions to the F2 to F10 hotkeys for each character. However, the former only cuts out one step while the latter would be more helpful if there were some on-screen indication of what's hot-keyed so you don't have to rely completely on your memory.

Action Trip Reviews PoR
Posted Monday, October 22, 2001 - 20:12 CET by Darien

This review of Pool of Radiance 2 by Action Trip once again praises the graphics over the actual gameplay. Thus a final score of only 68%.

The very beginning of the game looks quite promising as you will first get to feast your eyes on the beautiful surroundings of Myth Drannor, but you will also get to know the specific combat system. Each of the characters has limited time (represented by a green bar) to perform an action. Be it casting a spell, running or hand-to-hand combat, the bar will slowly shrink. The problem with this system is that it relies too much on the player reflexes, and practically disregards characters' capabilities and levels. Higher levels will, in this respect, bring your character only more new action to perform. This semi-turn-based, semi real-time gameplay has been made even more difficult by the (irritatingly slow) way enemy characters move. By the time the enemy reaches your ranks, you will be quite fed up with battle. And that's not the end of it - even when they start fighting, and constantly missing each other, in spite of the fact that they are inches away, this combat system will become your main reason for you urge to uninstall Pool of Radiance. (Careful with uninstalling it though - Ed.)

Read the review.

PoR Review at TFHGaming
Posted Monday, October 22, 2001 - 20:04 CET by Darien

Well, it seems the poor reviews continue to outweigh the good, when it comes to The Ruins of Myth Drannor. Here's another lukewarm review by TFHGaming, which scores POR2 at only 2.86 out of a possible 5 overall.

What saves the game from being a complete waste are the magnificent animations for both characters and monsters. The preview screenshots were no lie - characters run, swing, even quaff convincingly. The monsters are appropriately dangerous, creepy, or alien looking. While the backgrounds are not as colorful or dynamic as Baldur's Gate II, their sense of scale makes it feel less like the party is a bunch of miniatures moving on a grid.

But graphics are never enough, particularly in roleplaying games. Another omission in PoR is the very limited shopping opportunities for new items. I only encountered one merchant in the game, and he had virtually nothing worth buying, resulting in my party stockpiling a horde of gold made worthless...

Far from being the next-in-line to carry the D&D computer game legacy to new heights, PoR was close to being a disaster, given the bugs and - to a lesser extent - the missing features. For the players expecting an in-depth roleplaying experience at least on the level of the lesser gold box games, PoR is sadly lacking. Those who enjoy basic dungeon hacking and tactical combat, or who want to ogle the fantastic animations, may glean some fun from the experience. Otherwise, though it may mark the beginning of 3rd edition D&D for the computer, PoR is a step backward - off the pier - for D&D computer roleplaying.

Neverwinter Nights Forum Update
Posted Monday, October 22, 2001 - 19:54 CET by Darien

Greg Zeschuk, Joint-CEO:

PC Gamer Article: What was discussed in the recent PC Gamer article was one of the small features added to NWN to polish the game - as you mention it was either Ray or me that gave the quote to the magazine (can't remember which one...)

Anyway, the feature is quite simple - the second floor of buildings fade out when obscuring the character. This allows the player to see character when running around corners, etc. - making it easy for people to play the game. There is still a load delay (very slight) when you enter buildings and change locations.

Finally the building fade is the kind of feature added to make the game easier to play. Even though it's a small thing, all of those small things add up to make the game something special. This is certainly what we're working toward with Neverwinter Nights.

Derek French, Assistant Producer:

Pausing: Hi all. Good thread by the way, but it is getting too long and I have to close it. Once we get stickies working on this board, we will be able to park some of these issues at the top for people to see. The current plans for NWN and Pause-in-Play and issue-orders is that there will be no Pause-in-Play. As with all developmental things, this is subject to playtesting.

The one critical thing to realize is that NWN does not distinguish between 1 player or 64 players. It uses all the same code. Allowing user-based pause in a game with more than 1 player would be completely unworkable. If we were to add PiP for when the 1 player is both the client and the server, it would require a HUGE reworking of the Official Campaign in order to allow for PiP.

Short version: PiP no, but subject to playtesting.

Pause and Play: Fan Quote: "How can implementing a spell or special ability called "Pause in Play" be included or excluded from individual modules?"

Oooof! Now you have me confused. As far as I know, you cannot enable/disable spells or abilities. Sorry, but what does a spell in the game have to do with an engine level function of pausing the game? Oh, and good to see you, Bard, welcome!

Hey, I have been wrong before, but I will check on Monday on disabling spells/abilities at the module level. But, I am still confused as to what this has to do with engine-level pause.

First, everyone calm down. This is a good thread, and I have only had to delete a few flaming post from within it. Please re-read what you are about to post and remove any comments that you have directed at someone personally and not their concept. We will all get along better this way.

Bard (sorry, can't get used to the Lance name just yet ), now I see what you were talking about. What you are suggesting is that we have something in place in the engine that we won't use, but would be available for the community. I understand the idea, but with the limited development time we have, we cannot develop something that we are not going to use internally, and not something that would have such a dramatic impact on game balance. Sorry, but as per the other thread, it is all subject to playtesting.

More Pause and Play: Fan Quote: "Translation: "But surely adding the OPTION for those who WANT IT can only be a GOOD THING." But seriously: I'm confused. I thought the DM WAS going to have full pause-in-play functionality, and could therefore pause the game in order to do what he pleased. Is this not the case?"

Yes, DM pausing is in. What most people are talking about is in a 1 player game where the user is both the client and the server, being able to pause the game and issues orders to the player/henchmen under his/her control.

DM can pause and interact with the environment. Run scripts, inspect, spawn, adjust, etc. The DM gets PiP.

Class Kits: There are no kits in 3rd Edition, so there won't be in NWN. What we are doing is making "packages" that are a preset grouping of skills and feats to aid in the character creation process. They aren't really 2nd Ed. kits, but they do resemble them.

David Gaider, Designer:

Rangers: I'd have to agree about the ranger. In my experience, even players who are normally not the power-gaming type do little more than take the 1 level of Ranger required before moving onto either Fighter, Barbarian or whatever else fits their vision more closely. And one really can't blame them.

I don't know how much WotC would let the NWN crew change it, though. Keep in mind that changes to the monk or the 'class abilities that don't work' are related to their functionality in terms of converting the game to computer. The Ranger isn't broken, per se...what you're suggesting is an aesthetic change, even if the class would be overall more useful.

But it certainly doesn't hurt to campaign for what you want. I'm not saying change is impossible. Personally, I think the Bard and, to a lesser degree, the Druid are in need of something extra. While the Bard gets some fairly useful illusion spells, it gets those in exchange for even rudimentary attack spells... and its spellcasting limits per day are low, the bard song bonuses never increase and its fighting ability is quite hampered unless it dual-classes (in which case those decent spells are even further away).

In my home campaign, I give Bard the extra feats that the Wizard and Fighter have... making him more of the utility player he is meant to be... and I allow Druids to cast from their spell list as a Sorcerer does. It's the only thing that makes my players pick those classes. But, again, those are due to my personal preferences. At best, I think it would be great if NWN allowed for some ability on the DM's part to modify the classes a bit... although I have my doubts that that's possible, as it would be interpreted by most players as opening the door for prestige classes, I think.

Alan Miranda, Associate Producer:

Manual Translations by Fans: Yes, from what I have found, game manual translations (or "paper-parts") for lots of games (including some of the BG series) could be improved upon. Ensuring the best possible quality can be a challenge when translation houses are quite distant/removed from BioWare and the English version that we initially work on. Text translation is not something that we are able to review here, and in general such things are publisher handled. I think this issue will be something to keep in mind for NWN. Thanks for all the translation offers. We appreciate your enthusiasm.

Sound File Formats: No, the sound file format has not been finalized yet. In terms of quality, it would most likely be 16-bit, 22KHz, mono. I think this is what is used in most games, and it is what we used in BG.

David Chan, Audio Producer:

Custom Sounds: Alan is right in that most of the sound effects will probably be 16 bit, 22Khz mono or stereo. However, you will most likely be able to play back most standard sample rates and bit depths. Keep in my mind that the higher the bit depth and sample rate the higher the overhead.

Aidan Scanlan, Writing and Design:

Script Area Transition Random Encounter: This is possible to script.

The concern would be with manually cranking the clock forward. Time is global over all areas. If you pushed the clock forward when a character went through the transition, another character in the original area (or any other character for that matter) would suddenly find himself jumping through time. It is possible to enforce that the entire party go through the transition, but this isn't really desirable in an open format game. You would have to plan for all PC to be in same party (a fair assumption in a game designed for a small number of characters), otherwise the transition would become a choke point.

When you enter a standard area transition, i.e. one created by the wizard, a script will run that finds the waypoint that that trigger is linked to. It then jumps the entering object (character) to that waypoint. If you want, you could write your own script that specifies different waypoints depending on different conditions. Just (as Brother Amos says) make sure you have transitions that allow you to exit any areas that you send characters to.

Site News - New Additions
Posted Sunday, October 21, 2001 - 22:55 CET by Sorcerer

Subsection Updates - Games -> Pool of Radiance: RoMD

The FTP that was hosting the PoREdit save game editor is down, so I've put the file online myself. You can get the 1.9 version of this popular editor from the Editors, Hacks & Custom Characters subsection.

The official 1.2 patch that fixes several game issues has been released and can be obtained from the Miscellanea subsection.

Subsection Updates - Games -> Baldur's Gate

It was brought to my attention that I didn't have a single walkthrough for Dark Side of the Sword Coast listed, so I added one to the Walkthroughs & Guides subsection.

Subsection Updates - Games -> Baldur's Gate 2

The other romances guide that can be downloaded from the Tips, Tricks & Hints subsection was updated so that it now includes the Anomen romance. Ladies will be pleased. ;)

There is a new addition in the Editors, Hacks & Custom Characters - namely a new kit called the Sylvan Mystic.

Subsection Updates -> Community

Listing of the forums available at SP has been updated to include the new forum dubbed Creativity Surge. You are very welcome to post something there yourself.

Subsection Updates -> Fantasy Worlds

A slew of new stories posted on Boards O' Magick was added to the selection in the Fantasy Fiction subsection. All the links have been fixed as well, since the stories were moved to the new dedicated forum.

Pool of Radiance Review
Posted Saturday, October 20, 2001 - 22:53 CET by Darien

Game Nation has posted this generally positive review of The Ruins of Myth Drannor, scoring the game at 87%. The reviewer's biggest negative is the games focus on combat over story. Not a big deal if you enjoy a good dungeon crawl.

Keeping track of the adventure is wonderfully easy. It's all mouse driven, with an on-screen interface that stays out of the way, leaving 90% of the screen for gameplay at any time. This works because the game uses drop down menus to serve up your options when you need them. During any situation in the game, you can right click on any character or object, summoning up a set of drop-down options that summarize all of your choices.

Playing Pool of Radiance is a constant process of clicking and deciding. You click on an area to have your party travel there and you click on an enemy to have them attack it. Each character has their own abilities and tricks and these you can activate simply by right-clicking and selecting them...

I'll warn you now, the adventures are HUGE. The first dungeon you'll enter stretches on forever and ever and in myriad set of twists and turns just the way a dungeon should, but it can be disorienting beyond belief. Thankfully you can chuck away the graph paper as the map mode is perfect. When you switch over to the map screen, you'll find a fully 3D map showing the areas you've explored as well as key items such as stairs and signposts through a set of icons. Your party is shown individually by their combat colour circles (so if one goes wondering off in a spell-induced daze, you'll know where). You can even drop little post-it flags throughout the map and attach important notes to yourself to them such as "Fountain of Healing here".

Read the full review.

Last Week's Poll Results
Posted Saturday, October 20, 2001 - 19:49 CET by Sorcerer

What we asked:

Q: Do you ever get tired of playing computer RPGs?
(354 votes total)

Sometimes (172) 49%
No, never (168) 47%
Yes, constantly (14) 4%

Although playing computer role-playing games is undeniably fun, it also becomes tiresome from time to time. Approximately a half (49%) of people who voted in the poll say that they sometimes get tired of playing them.

Interestingly enough, another (almost) half, 47% to be exact, never gets tired of playing these games.

Only 4% of people who play them also constantly get tired of them.

Boo is Back!
Posted Saturday, October 20, 2001 - 5:05 CET by Darien

Boo is back in the spotlight again, this time on his knees... Check out this comic strip at MegaTokyo.

Neverwinter Nights Forum Update
Posted Saturday, October 20, 2001 - 4:39 CET by Darien

Greg Zeschuk, Joint-CEO:

Greetings: Hello..... We are reading the boards but we've been ultra busy so haven't had much of a chance to post yet. You'll likely find me and Ray active on the boards in the wee hours of the morning.

Posting times: I can't guarantee what time we usually post. We're usually up playing various games (Dark Age of Camelot and NWN lately...

MMORPGs: The best thing about MMPORPGs is after a long day of work people from BioWare can play together defeating villainy across the lands of whatever game we happen to be playing.

Lately it's been Dark Ages of Camelot: watch for our guild shortly on Morgan Le Fay (Albion Realm). A few of us were playing Anarchy Online and we've got a number of guys still playing Everquest. AC and UO are also still in the repertoire for some.

Main thing that's fun about them - the social aspect and roleplaying. As long as the game system works, and you've got good people to play with they can be alot of fun.

Ray Muzyka, Joint-CEO:

Greetings: Just thought I'd say hello as well - can't let Greg be the only one who says hello!

Can We Play Too?: Certainly, but for NWN you'll have to wait a bit, our versions are limited editions right now.

Trent Oster, Producer:

Quaterstaff: Currently the Quarterstaff is in as two handed, so the 1.5 multiplier would apply. While we do have double weapon functionality in I'm not sure of how we would offer the choice to wield a weapon or how we could visually indicate which mode you are currently using.

Playing a Mage: Playing the game right at this moment, mages kick ass. I summon my bat familiar, summon a monster, stoneskin myself and the animals and go bezerk with lightning bolts. Also, if you spend feats correctly, you could have armor or melee abilities. 3rd Edition offers a massive number of options.

Other Classes: Sadly, we don't have time in the development schedule to implement any classes other than the basic classes we have already mentioned.

No Tarrasque: The Tarrasque won't make it into the initial version of NWN. While I love the idea of a creature who wipes out entire cities in a few minutes I don't like the idea of having to model that bloody big of a critter.

Targeting Spells: Targeting a spell is not bad right now. The really fast and small creatures are harder to hit, but they usually aren't much of a challenge. We are discussing a number of alternate targeting techniques as well.

Improvements in Quickslot: It doesn't work yet, but it is something we identified as a feature to add. We also just added Rob Bartel's idea from a while back. You have 12 quickslots by default. Hold the control key and 12 others appear. Hold the shift and yet another 12 appear. So, you now have 36 quickslots to place items, skills, spells or feats into.

User Created Models: This is an area we are very interested in supporting, but as of yet we do not have the tools available to the end users to create content.

Shadows on Screenshots: I'm curious as to which screenshots you are referring. The shadows are generated at render time by the engine using the silhouette edges of the geometry. If the shadows aren't right, here are two possible issues.
1- the art was exported without the proper flags
2- The character is indeed floating and there is an incorrect data entry or animation keyframe.

Potrait Styles: The portraits will be in one major style, with some minor variation within that style.

Interplay Demo: We don't have much to say about the internal demo, as it is internal and not for public release. sorry.

Bob McCabe, Writing & Design:

On That Two Hour Demo: The demo is nothing unique.

As far as I know (which isn't saying much) every company releases demonstrations of their product just about every month, sometimes more or less frequently, to their publishers. I mean, the publishers are putting money into the title, I'd think that they would want to see what they're getting in return. :)

Point Buy Debate: I mentioned this before, many times, but I like the point buy system, and I don't mind the number being set at 25. But... if I had to change it...

I like the idea of all stats starting at a lower number, getting an initially small number of points to raise those low stats, and then gaining more frequent bonus points as you gain levels (that you would be able to store up for the more costly increases). I'd like to think this system is just "more of the same", but really, I think my "revision" is just more complicated than it needs to be, but whatever. :) Here are some numbers:

All stats start at 4. The player gets 18 points, and going up to a stat value of 10 would be done at a cost of 1:1, an 11 and 12 would cost 2 points each, a 13 and 14 would cost 3 points each, and so forth. Instead of getting bonus points every 4 levels, a player would gain 6 points each level (and then spend them just as they would in point buy).

I think this system would stress development - starting weak and ending up powerful - providing the player with choices to make at every level gain, but like I said, I think it's just more complicated :) But you asked for alternatives, so here is mine.

I'm undecided :) I like how your system scales upward after spending 9 points (or increasing your stats above 12). I feel like my system encourages players to have exceptional stats instead of more balanced stats, but I'm not really sure how I feel about that :) My system would also allow for players to have stats into the mid-20s pretty easily. Considering that I tend to run low-powered campaigns, I find that bit disturbing :)

Oh well... maybe we'll get some more suggestions to look over in this thread *wink, wink* ;)

As for using 3d6, 4d6, and other "standard" systems, I'm not sure what we'll end up doing. We don't want to create disparate groups of players within the community - and providing for different methods of rolling would hamper those efforts. However, the game is all about customization, too, so it might be feasible to allow players to easily modify their attributes, with a warning that their player might be ineligible for vault campaigns.

At this point, I can't really say, and this is all my own personal speculation, so... take it all with a big grain of salt. :)

On an almost related side note, I don't really like the inclusion of numbers in my campaign; I find them, from the point of view of the player, to be unnecessary. In many of my campaigns, I will not let the player see what his stats are, what his current HPs are, what his bonus to hit is - I generally won't even allow them to see what their die roll is, which sometimes has led me to play without dice). I find that this enhances the simplicity of story-telling in a game. :)

But back to the topic, I totally agree with you. There is so much going on at a level-up that including stat-buying at every level would just be too much, especially considering in how many ways those stats influence other things, such as skills and saving throws - which is why I said I like the system(s) D&D uses. :)

As for tangible evidence of progression for a character, I often wonder where the focus should be. Should the character become super human in ability (improving stats), should he become exceptionally skilled at his chosen craft (improving skills), or should he never really change, but simply get better by virtue of his gear? Things to think about, I guess... :)

Creating a Monk: Quote: "Aranthalas wrote: NeoMaul, A monk needs 4 exceptional stats. Str, Dex, Con, Wis. Now maybe the monk is not supposed to be a frontline fighter, but what else is he going to do if not fight?"

Well, here's how I made my level 6 monk (this is actually a 4d6 character, but he works out to 22 points in the point-buy):

STR 11
DEX 16
CON 10 (raised from 9 at level 4)
INT 13
WIS 13
CHA 8

I used my first feat to purchase weapon finesse (fists) to eliminate the need for STR. I'll use my next level up to put a point into INT, and then the point after that (provided, of course, that my character survives) into WIS. I'll still have 2 more points, which I will likely use for DEX.

But your point, Aranthalas, is that my monk might rock, but he has (in a CRPG) no identity. Am I right?

What can the monk do that no other class can do, that would make you want to play him? The fighter can fight better than anyone, the rogue has stealth and lock-picking, the bard can sing, etc. etc... but what can the monk do that another class can't do, and more?

And at this point, all I can say is that I can't answer that yet But it *is* our job to make each of the classes desirable. I mean, it's already there in the P&P version of the game - we just have to make sure it's *still* there in the NWN version of the game.

Monk Stats: Quote: "Gromnir wrote: in the past, the nwn developers has been rather sensitive to criticism of 25 point monk. showed examples of a 22 or 23 point monk that they was very happy with as an example. Point is that developers not seem to be convinced that monks is feebs at 25 points… may be tough to change their minds this late in game."

That was my 22-point monk that I championed the 25-point buy cause with (he's now level 6, with a whopping 28 hit points and a 15 AC - but totally fun to play). And though I still feel that way (that 25 points is more than enough for any class), I'm just one member of the NW team.

Still, the point was brought up that without many of their special abilities (such as falling), what role does a monk serve within a party? Wouldn't a pure fighter always be more useful? And, well, that's a good question - and also one that we can't answer until we get closer to release and start revealing more details of the classes.

But I can say that I personally feel bumping the monk up a few points in the point buy system isn't going to make any difference; the monk has to be balanced in other ways, and that's something that will be focused on during play-testing.

Abilities and Monks: Quote: "Aranthalas wrote: For a caster, your key ability bonus (Int for Wizard for example) increases the Difficulty Class (DC) of all your spells. ... It is a very big deal indeed."

While I completely agree with you, the difference between an intelligence of 17 and an intelligence of 20, in terms of DC, is only 2 points, right? It's a definite advantage, but maybe not one worth spending so many points on

Quote: "Namirrha wrote: Will monks be able to use Quivering Palm more than once a week, perhaps once a day? The monk need not get more points, but perhaps other minor tweaks should be thought of to help make up for some of its deficits."

I can't answer this yet, but having it at once per week is probably something we will have to change. In a CRPG, it isn't as much fun to be not be able to use your abilities that you've worked so hard to get. We might make it one use per rest period, but then weaken it somehow - i.e. instant death on creatures of a certain HD or less, a certain amount of damage per HD over that. Repeating - this is an example, and not indicative of any direction that we are leaning in on this issue!

Half-Orc Monks: Quote: "Lysandus Majere wrote: Will there be Half-Orc Monks in NWN. Cause they are the best."

Yes. Though I agree with the others... why would you want to play a half-orc? *snobby elven noises* :)

Story Styles: I really enjoyed Iron Monkey, but I think you have to admit that Iron Monkey is a different kind of movie than Crouching Tiger.

Crouching Tiger is a movie that focused more on emotion and philosophy, and was very much about reaching potential and following your chosen path.

Iron Monkey is more a movie with a common theme: standing up to injustice and fighting for the common man - or Robin Hood in a sense.

I don't necessarily think that the story in Iron Monkey was in any way lesser - it was just a different type of story with a different presentation. I felt like Crouching Tiger was presented more as an art film with a love story focus, while Iron Monkey was reminiscent of the 80's Kung Fu Theatre on Saturday afternoons.

Anyway, as this all relates to Neverwinter Nights, I'm sure you can guess our response to this topic: we're very committed to providing an entertaining story.

I read somewhere that there are two differing styles for the presentation of a game story. You can let the set game set up the stage, and provide the actors, but allow the player to control the action, or you can allow the game to write out the script, and allow the player to be guided down the path toward the climax.

I think we've always strived for a balanced approach here. It's one thing to create a compelling story for the player, another to allow that story to take center stage. As one of the writers on Neverwinter Nights, it's sometimes hard for me to pull back a notch and allow the game to be the focus when I really want to show off with an amazing story - but we're all about making a game that's fun, right?

:) PS Iron Monkey was made in 1993 or 1994, so it's not exactly ripping off the Matrix ;)

David Chan, Audio Producer:

The Composer: We have a composer in mind that I think everyone will like. I'll let you know when I can say anything about it.

Quality of Single Player Game: Don't worry, the single player in NWN will be on par with all of our past games. We know how important single player is and a lot of time and effort are being put into it. As for Cespenar, we'll have to see...

Jonathan Epp, Quality Assurance:

Equiping for Battle: I think currently it works sort of like that. You equip the two-handed weapon and the shield automatically unequips and goes back into general inventory. As for having the shield remain in the shield slot but have it unusable - well, I can't say how feasible such a feature would be, but it can be argued that this should not happen because the slot is specifically for items that are actually equipped. Not a bad idea though.

Derek French, Assistant Producer:

Release Date: There is no release date for Neverwinter Nights. When we have a release date, this post will change with the addition of the release date.

The release dates that you see at retail sites are their best guess as to when the game will ship. Sorry, but it is just that; a guess.
That being said, things are progressing quite smoothly on the game and we are still on track for a release this winter season.

Sorry for all the confusion people... Winter 2001 = December 21st, 2001 through March 20, 2002. We have been saying this all along and I have to reinterate that this is NOT new news, nor is it a change. And that this is still not an Official Release date, but when we expect the game to come out.

None of us realized that there was any confusion over what Winter 2001/this Winter season meant. Sorry. This is no change from before. "This winter season" is exactly the same as "Winter 2001" there is no difference, thus no change.

Beta News: *cries* WHERE ARE MY STICKY POSTS?!?!?! We have no information on the beta at this time. When we do it will be posted on the main BioWare page as well as in the Official Announcement forum.

PvP in Game: Pvp in NWN will have several options, everything from no Pvp at all, party vs party Pvp and full Pvp. As for class balancing, the 3rd Edition rules offer an interesting balance.

Monks: As to the toughness of monks, with a few unarmed attack feats and attacks like flurry of blows, a monk is going to be very tough.

Board Questions: Hi, this topic has been covered quite a bit and we are making all kinds of changes and there are more to come.

Don't like the colours? Edit your preferences and select one of the 2 alternate themes.

Widening? Not sure right now, but there are several reasons why they are this way. One is its easier to read a narrow column of words than a huge wide one (think newspaper column). We may do something about this.

Buttons for BB tags don't work on all browsers, but we may add them in.

Developer posts are linked at the top now.

Many more improvements are coming.

Speed will increase for some users once we get our fatter internet pipe in about 3 weeks or so. This board is blazingly fast from home for me, and I am quite a few hops away.

If you have any suggestions or issues, please e-mail either biomoderator@bioware.com or webmaster@bioware.com

Thanks.

Alan Miranda, Associate Producer:

Music in NWN: Trust us - NWN will have awesome sounding music composed by a truly fantastic composer (one of my personal favourites). At BioWare we strive to outdo every previous game we've done in all respects, and this is no exception when it comes to music. Get ready for a soulful and epic score! I can't say anything just yet, but I'm sure you guys will be pleased.

Just so everyone knows, here are the previous composers on BG
BG1: Michael Hoenig
BG2-SoA: Michael Hoenig
BG2-ToB: Inon Zur and Howard Drossnin

I've always loved the music in BG and I worked closely with Inon and Howard to get something great for ToB, which got great reviews. Our goals are similarly as high for Neverwinter.

Different Music?: The BG games built up the Bhaal saga that finished with Throne of Bhaal. With Neverwinter being a new product with a new story and new characters, it would make more sense to create new themes to fit these. The BG music was great, but its best fit is within BG. NWN will have a flavour all its own.

Paul Roffel, Programmer:

NWN as a MMORPG: Okay, here's a tidbit of information for you... Neverwinter Nights WILL have the potential for massive multiplay... sort of...

Basically, the servers will have 64 clients potential right out of the box. And you'll be able to run multiple servers on a single machine. Now, if you were to take a module of a city, per say, and split it up acrossed 6 or 8 different areas, link those areas together with jumps, say small doors or such. And then ran them all on the same machine, you'd have 384 or 512 people running on that machine.

Now, you WOULD have to have a HUGE machine to pull this off with TONS of bandwidth, but the potential IS there. You could also split it up over multiple machines and make it even bigger. And, of course, you just never turn the machines off and whamo! You've got a persistant world that people can log into, play, chat, enjoy the world, quest, and whatnot. And then go off to other dungeons/modules to do quests, come back and sell stuff off.

It's all there, and it's all possible. Just a disclaimer, it ain't "officially" a MMORPG, but darnit, with a little effort, you COULD use it to make one. (Your very own little world)

Thought you might like this... we've got the best of both worlds.

Desslock on BioWare vs. Interplay
Posted Friday, October 19, 2001 - 5:13 CET by Darien

Desslock has gives his opinion on the recent move of the NWN message boards, as well as a short commentary on the current situation between Bioware and Interplay.

BioWare has taken ownership of the Neverwinter Nights boards, as you can read the press release. The release suggests that the plan to "nationalize" the boards has been in the works for a while, since BioWare apparently hired a new "community manager" a month ago. A number of you have written to me to express concern about the future of Neverwinter Nights, and I wouldn't give claims that the game is cancelled any credence - these developments are far more likely just reflects BioWare's ongoing desire to distance itself from the publisher it has become most associated with, as well as some acrimony between the companies because BioWare is suing Interplay for selling the European publishing rights for BioWare's games without BioWare's consent. I wrote last month the companies are currently in litigation against each other, wh! ich has likely created (and is evidence of the) acrimony, so you're unlikely to see the companies cooperating with each until their litigation is resolved.

Read more.

PoR Review at Gamehelper
Posted Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 16:40 CET by Darien

Gamehelper has posted a rather long review of The Ruins of Myth Drannor, giving the game an overall score of 4.6 out of 6.

The game itself looks decent. The characters are nicely modeled with nice animations and effects for spells. It customizes their appearance based on what armor and weapon they are carrying. The same is true for the monsters, and I am particularly fond of how the undead fall when they are killed – like a puppet with each string being cut.

The sounds are actually quite nice, and the soundtrack – in context – goes a lot farther. The voices of orcs and rattling bones of undead really heighten the mood as they should. I hope there will be more combat music, however, as at this point I have heard the same track over and over and over and I’m still very early in the game.

The boards are massive. Though the textures are nice and interesting to look at, I got the feeling they were cramming every square foot into the space, which makes navigation a bad kind of challenging. The way certain wall sections are drawn is misleading, making me think there are passages where really none exist, or that I am missing some entrance to access an area when really I have to go waaaay over to the other side of the map to access it.

The challenge level of the game is downright brutal in spots, with tedium soon after setting in. The auto-save “feature” is virtually non-existent even though I have seen evidence of its passing. You would expect an auto-save after each camp, but not so. That assumption cost me over an hour of spelunking. It appears to only auto-save at transition points between levels or areas. Boooo.

You don’t play this game for a storyline, either, though again there is evidence that one will develop. At this point in the game, Gauntlet has more going for it in this department. The descriptions of the setting come mostly in pop up text from the “DM” that you must click on in order to progress.

Read the rest here.

Shadows of Amn Unofficial Expansion
Posted Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 16:29 CET by Darien

If you finished BGII: Shadows of Amn and still want more, here's your chance. TeamBG has released The Darkest Day, an unofficial expansion to SoA.

Want more excitement? Want more intrigue? Want more creatures...more treasure? New quests, new NPC's, new creatures, new items, new spells, new areas, and new levels to be reached. See what happens when the fans add to one of the worlds most successful computer role-playing games ever. Users of TeamBG utilities prove how ingenious they can be with the raw materials this fourth generation of the Infinity Engine provided in the excellent and innovative game "Baldur's Gate II: Shadows of Amn." This is the first of many new unofficial Infinity Engine game products to come.

Size: 266.2 MB (279153767 bytes)
Download Time: 18 hours, 27 minutes at 33.6 Kbps

9 New and Returning (from BG1) NPC's
180+ New Items
170+ New Spells
39+ New Creatures
75 New Kits
40+ Minor Quests
5 Major Quests
1 Mega Quest
Over 30 hours estimated minimum added game play!

Download from FilePlanet.

Pool of Radiance Hangs on to Number One
Posted Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 10:46 CET by Nazgul

From the GAMESPOT website.

Ubi Soft's Dungeons & Dragons role-playing game retains the lead in NPD's latest list of best-selling games.

Ubi Soft's Pool of Radiance: Ruins of Myth Drannor held on to the top spot in NPD Intelect's latest weekly list of best-selling games. The game debuted at number one on the previous week's list in spite of several complaints about technical problems. Electronic Arts' popular virtual-life game The Sims came in at second place, followed by Blizzard's role-playing game expansion Diablo II: Lord of Destruction. Remarkably, Infogrames' theme park management game RollerCoaster Tycoon came in at fourth place, a full two and a half years after its initial release. While a low average price of $20 must have helped sales, the game has remained on the top-10 list of best-selling games almost continuously since its release in March 1999. Fifth place went to Operation Flashpoint, Codemasters' latest tactical shooter. Another notable entry on the list is Eidos Interactive's tactical strategy game Commandos 2: Men of Courage, which jumped into eighth place on the list during its first week of release.

The list below ranks games according to number of retail sales. To see a list of games ranked according to GameSpot review score, visit our Top Games page.

Top-selling PC games for the week of September 30-October 6, 2001:

Rank / Title / Publisher / Average price
1 / Pool of Radiance: Ruins of Myth Drannor / Ubi Soft / $40
2 / The Sims / Electronic Arts / $40
3 / Diablo II: Lord of Destruction / Vivendi Universal / $32
4 / Roller Coaster Tycoon / Infogrames / $20
5 / Operation Flashpoint / Codemasters / $41
6 / The Sims: House Party / Electronic Arts / $29
7 / The Sims: Livin' Large / Electronic Arts / $29
8 / Commandos 2: Men of Courage / Eidos / $34
9 / Diablo Battle Chest / Vivendi Universal / $44
10 / Diablo II / Vivendi Universal / $35

PoR Patch Update
Posted Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 4:27 CET by Darien

The official Pool of Radiance site has been updated, and the latest patch is now ready.

Update: October 17, 2001
Patch 1.2 is now available for download. Here's what is addressed with this latest patch:

- Fixes various save game corruptions;
- Fixes an IP address problem in multiplayer play;
- Fixes a minor bug in game play at the end of the game.

Patch v1.2 does not contain the fixes contained in Patch v1.1. You do not need to have Patch v1.1 installed before installing Patch v1.2.

More detailed release notes are included within the patch file itself.

New Bioware Message Board
Posted Wednesday, October 17, 2001 - 15:53 CET by Darien

In a press release yesterday, Bioware announced the opening of a new Official Message Board in an effort to bring the gaming community and the developers closer.

EDMONTON, Alberta, Canada – October 16th, 2001 – BioWare Corp. today unveiled its new plan for game community development. Last month, the award winning developer of the Baldur’s Gate saga announced the creation of a new position, the BioWare Community Manager, that will act as a community evangelist for BioWare. The next phase of the plan will occur tomorrow, October 17th, 2001. BioWare will then unveil the first of the Official BioWare Message Boards designed to provide the gaming community with a forum where they can interact directly with the game development team.

The BioWare message boards are part of the company’s multi-phase strategy to improve customer service and fan communication. "The recently created Customer Service Technician position is already considered a success by everyone here." Said Greg Zeschuk, Joint CEO of BioWare. "Later this week, we’ll be unveiling our message boards. Our Community Manager will help focus this effort, and our fan community will have the best access to BioWare it’s ever had."

"The Neverwinter Nights community includes some of the most inspirational and supportive people we’ve ever had the honour to work with. It’s important that we have a clear understanding of their needs," said Ray Muzyka, Joint CEO of BioWare. "As we’ve grown, we’ve recognized the extreme importance the fan community has in the game development process. By hiring a Community Manager and setting up our own message board, we can only improve our customer service and fan relations."

The Official BioWare Message Board will launch tomorrow, October 17th, 2001 at 12:00 (MST) and can be linked from the main BioWare website at http://www.bioware.com. Other BioWare project message boards will be launched as we upgrade our infrastructure to accommodate the growth plans, and will be announced on both the official BioWare website, and in the media. The BioWare Community Manager appointment will be announced within the month.

NWN Developer Interview
Posted Wednesday, October 17, 2001 - 2:10 CET by Darien

Hardwarezone has interviewed some of the guys from the NWN team. Trent Oster and others talk about the basics of the game with comments on the DM's role, the Aurora Toolset, and the possibility of "cheating."

Trent (Neverwinter Aurora Toolset): The role of a Dungeon Master in Neverwinter Nights is completely up to the person who is filling the role. One DM might want to role-play the characters that the players meet, and so he/she would assume the role of the various NPCs by possessing them, and then speak through them to the players. Another DM might place orc ambushes on the fly, making sure to manage the difficulty of the combat while the players are engaged for an epic battle. Another DM might just enjoy watching the players travel through his/her creation. In short, the DM has every power that we can grant.

Of course, that’s just what happens during the game. Outside of the game session, however, the DM can make use of the Neverwinter Toolset – a utility that is an integral part of the Neverwinter Nights concept, and that allows the end-user to create his/her own adventures. Since the toolset was the origin of our focus, we had to really spend some time properly designing it. We knew that we would be using this exact same toolset to create the single-player/multi-player campaign that would be shipping in the game box, and we also knew how high our own standards were for making a quality game. The end result is a toolset with the power to create an engrossing adventure and the ease-of-use that will hopefully have everyone contributing to the pool of adventures for the community.

Read more.

Disappointing Debut of PoR
Posted Wednesday, October 17, 2001 - 1:55 CET by Darien

An in-depth discussion with Producer Garrett Graham is the focus of this article at CG Online. Graham talks about the many problems with the game, including various bugs, rule changes and allegations of altered dice rolls.

Graham is sympathetic to impatient gamers. "I certainly understand why people are angry," he says, and notes that he's not making any excuses for what went wrong. What he does offer, though, is some background and explanation for why the Pool project turned out the way it did. In many ways, the history of this project offers an object lesson in how not to develop a game. Nearly everything that could go wrong, did. The publisher changed four times. Producers came and went. The team lost and gained members. Most importantly, the game made the huge leap from 2nd Edition AD&D to 3rd Edition D&D rules, an epic transiti